Incident at the YMCA - any thoughts?

[connorsdad]

Recently I rejoined the YMCA to help work off the holiday pounds. Also not to mention but it is a place that I can go nude at and feel somewhat that I am getting more relaxed in nude situations so my first resort trip will go over fine.

Anyway, usually I go nude in the locker room, changing, showering, etc. as normal as well as other guys. The locker room is a family locker room, male only and females if they are under 5 years old are allowed to be in the men's family locker room. Now, it is nothing to see boys and men nude in here and the occasional nude girl under 5 years old. Been this way for years.

But tonight at the Y, my son and I had gone swimming, were in the shower, it is an open shower, and rinsing off nude. A father and his little girl came in, she was 4 or 5 and I became extremely uncomfortable with being nude in front of this girl and did everything I could to keep her from seeing me. She did do some staring at Connor at times, it was almost as she never had seen anyone other then her dad nude.

I wanted to say something to the father but did not as it was all I could do from running out. When we left the showers, thier locker was, of course, right next to ours, and this made it even worst.

The girl and father both changed, both were nude, but she kept staring towards us and had to be directed by her dad at times to keep getting dressed and stay focused.

What actually does this mean? Does this mean that I will never be comfortable in a nudist resort / situation? Or was it a normal response and others would have felt the same way? It was kind of a wake up call.

Any thoughts? Thanks.

[DenitaLC]

Although girls under 5 are allowed in this locker room, it is still a 'mens' area. I am guessing that you were most likely taken off guard, especially being caught in the shower, nude when they came in. Sometimes you just have to tell yourself that you aren't doing anything wrong. So many men seem to fear being nude around children do to the programing society has created about preditors/victims. I'm sure the little girl was just curious seeing another dad/child nude in there. Kids stare, they don't know better and mean nothing ill by it.

I think you'll find in a nudist setting, when everyone is nude, you will feel more comfortable because it is the norm. Don't give up on visiting a resort and don't let this small bump in the road change your freedom at the Y.

:)
Dee

[Shanghaist]

My situation is reverse in that I have a little girl under five. I take her in the locker room at our club in Shanghai. But out of respect for the other men, I keep her away from looking (actually staring which she shouldn't do in any nudist context, but little ones are quite curious). She is used to seeing me naked, so that rarely happens.

[David77]

I think you'll find in a nudist setting, when everyone is nude, you will feel more comfortable because it is the norm. Don't give up on visiting a resort and don't let this small bump in the road change your freedom at the Y.
I very much agree with the above quote.

I think I know how you feel when showering and changing at the Y with a five year old girl stareing at you. Our several Ys in our county have the same policy of allowing girls up to 5 years old to use the men's locker room. After that age, the father and daughter can go together to one of the family shower/changing rooms (sometimes called "special needs rooms"). I have delayed showering until after the girl got out of the shower room, as I did not want possible stares.

However, at a naturist resort where everyone is nude, it makes no difference. At many resorts males and females shower together. People there have learned not to stare. At the resort, there is nothing new for children to stare at, as they have been seeing a collection of nude persons for some time.

[nudiarist]

Something very similar happened to me a couple of years ago at the Y. I was nude in the shower and a man brought his little girl right within view. I think that I did the right thing by continuing with my shower as if they were not even there.

Children will sometimes stare, especially if they are not familiar with social nudity. It's just normal curiousity. At a resort, kids might look, but they lose interest quickly and get on with normal play.

There's no reason to feel uncomfortable, but it's understandable why you reacted the way you did because a nude child staring at your nudity is not something you expect to happen in a locker room. At a nudist resort, you will not have that problem because everyone there is of the same mindset.

Good luck!

nudiarist
Diary of a Nudist
http://www.nudiarist.blogspot.com

[narod]

Our YMCA is the same way. There tend to be a couple girls in the men's locker room, each time Iv'e been in there. My wife says it's the same way in the women's locker room with mothers and their boys. However, she says the boys usually go about their business, and don't stare. I've been in the locker room, in the gang shower, when the middle school aged boys swimming team is showering before or after swim team pracice. There have been small girls in there, also. Sometimes the boys freak out. I just go on as if the girls aren't there. I have actually had women ask me to take their sons in the men's locker room, after swimming, and stay with them until they are ready to come out of the locker room. That's fine. But I'm not sure most parents are that trusting.

[vanesa1017]

I agree. You were not doing anything wrong. It might feel awkward because that is your first time in that sort of situation but if you keep going to the Y it will probably not be the last. It in fact will probably be the norm which is a good thing because you will get used to that sort of thing. Just smile, shower, get dressed and don't pay it any mind, there is nothing wrong at all in that situation.

[walter05]

I have found this to be embarrassing in a men's room. This is particularly an issue at a rest area.

Men are afraid to send their daughters into the women's rest room alone. Sometimes the daughters are clearly up to 10.

If I am standing at a urinal, and a young girl stares, I will look at the father and say he is invading my privacy.

The father will say she has seen it before.

I agree that it is embarrassing.

[Lord Drakkus]

It's just natural childhood curiosity. I think it's more common for the little girls to stare because it's much less common for little girls to be in that situation than it is for a little boy. There are more single mothers than single fathers, and by extension there would have to be more mothers in the locker rooms with their sons, than men in the locker rooms with their daughters.

The simple fact that the father brought his daughter in there says a lot, as well. He should know that there's likely to be naked men in there, and therefore has no valid reason to be upset if you're nude. If he does get upset, just politely tell him that you're there for a specific purpose, and that it requires nudity to be done properly.

If the girl stares, try not to worry about it. She's just a kid and doesn't know better yet. Just look at her, smile politely, and continue with your business. The less of an issue we make of it, the less of an issue the children will have with it. And that will benefit everybody in the end.

[Nude123]

I would have continued on with what I doing and engage the girl in conversation. Ask her name. Does she have any brothers or sisters? Favorite toy or doll. Does she like school? Normal kid conversation to break her stare and make you look less of an object of interest. This would also get your mind off of her staring because she would be looking you in the eye instead of in the penis. Kids are kids and learning that you can talk with them will help them to learn about growing up both in the clothed and naked world. I run across kids all the time in my job and talking to them makes them feel grown up and impresses the parents that you are not a snot

[walter05]

I would avoid a conversation with a little girl staring at your penis. This could lead to trouble.

By the way, I have seen boys staring at men's penises in locker rooms also.

The staring is curiosity.

However, I do think a male in a male only nudity expected place should not be on display without his permission.

I have four daughters and never would have brought any in.

As far as boys in women's rest rooms, the stalls have doors. It is not like open urinals.

We never allowed our boys in women's locker rooms either.

If a man is naked his scrotum and penis are quite visible. If a woman is not shaved, her vulva is not as obvious if she is seen.

[Shanghaist]

Again, I agree with what everyone has stated. Like I said my three year old does not stare because she sees her older brother and me naked all the time. Last night we were sitting in the sauna and she is happily talking with a gentleman from Hong Kong. No staring. I think it comes down to their curiousity about anatomy since male's genitalia is more visible. The reason my wife is comfortable with my nudity around our girls is that she grew up with four sisters and never saw her dad naked. She had no idea what the male body looked like and was a bit shocked the first time.

My best advice is the same do not act any difference and just move about like you normally do. The girls father should be having a conversation with his little girls, but may not be because of our lack of societal maturity with the naked body. I have conversations regularly with my children because morays are learned not intrinsic. What is proper and what is not proper (e.g. social nudity is okay and is not sexual). My "additional 2c's.

[connorsdad]

Last night we were sitting in the sauna and she is happily talking with a gentleman from Hong Kong. No staring. I think it comes down to their curiousity about anatomy since male's genitalia is more visible.

Just curious, why would you have a 3 yo in the sauna? Can't be healthy.

[connorsdad]

I would have continued on with what I doing and engage the girl in conversation. Ask her name. Does she have any brothers or sisters? Favorite toy or doll. Does she like school? Normal kid conversation to break her stare and make you look less of an object of interest. This would also get your mind off of her staring because she would be looking you in the eye instead of in the penis. Kids are kids and learning that you can talk with them will help them to learn about growing up both in the clothed and naked world. I run across kids all the time in my job and talking to them makes them feel grown up and impresses the parents that you are not a snot

:confused::confused::confused:Are you serious? You think it would be okay to be standing nude in front a of little girl you do not know and engage in conversation with her? This would not be acceptable in my opinion at a nudist resort or the Y, especially the YMCA. Any normal person would think that this would be crazy and possibly considered a pedo.

Now if you are at a park and have your kids/grandkids there etc., then possibly be okay.

[nudiarist]

:confused::confused::confused:Are you serious? You think it would be okay to be standing nude in front a of little girl you do not know and engage in conversation with her? This would not be acceptable in my opinion at a nudist resort or the Y, especially the YMCA. Any normal person would think that this would be crazy and possibly considered a pedo.

Now if you are at a park and have your kids/grandkids there etc., then possibly be okay.

Unless you are a well-known quantity, engaging in conversation with a nude child at a nudist resort or park will get you noticed fast. Even if your intentions are of the utmost innocent, parents and resort personnel are on the lookout for child predators.

One time I was a first-time visitor (with my wife and two friends) at an Ohio resort. I was at the pool and needed to use the rest room. When I went in there was a young boy at the urinal, alone. I closed the door and waited outside until he was finished. It's sad to even have to think this way, but society has a child predator phobia these days and you cannot be too careful.

nudiarist
Diary of a Nudist
http://www.nudiarist.blogspot.com

[Kari P]

Just curious, why would you have a 3 yo in the sauna? Can't be healthy.

Not so unhealthy as you might think. The duration of exposure to the heat of the sauna must be restricted for young children, but it isn't so that they couldn't visit the sauna at all. This is on the responsibility of the parent if the child hasn't yet experienced sauna sufficiently many times to know when the time to leave the sauna comes.

[ranul]

I would look at both of them and simple say Hello . If they respond fine if they don't then I will keep on doing what I was doing before getting ready to go swimming .

[connorsdad]

I would look at both of them and simple say Hello . If they respond fine if they don't then I will keep on doing what I was doing before getting ready to go swimming .

The question isnt about how to talk to them, but more the uneasy feeling I had when the girl was in the shower. Lets not stray off topic.

[liberalal]

As i understand the facts, you are a single dad with an eight or nine year old
son with whom you have shared home nudism since he was very young.
You expect in the near future to go to a venue to experience nudism more fully. In the meantime you go to the Y where you know that young girls under five years of age are allowed in an area where you and your son may be nude (e.g. the shower.)
This young girl who is five years or younger and who is with her father (who also may be a single dad) stares at you and your son, then later undresses with her dad right by you and your son.
Instead of being freaked out by this, this would still be a good opportunity to explain to your son that this is what nudism is all about, the chance for males, females, young, old, family, strangers to be unclothed with others and be comfortable about it.
As far as your reaction, i believe it was an overreaction because you have not expanded your nudist exposure and will probably be remedied after your upcoming experience at a nudist venue. Just one mans opinion.

[Shanghaist]

Just to clarify on the Sauna. Chinese sauna, so not hot and she sat on the floor for 5 minutes at the end of my 15. I am aware that you have to exercise some care, but I lived in Europe where sauna time is a family event. I want the same for my children.

I agree with those who say do not engage in conversation. Seems to me, but I do not have all the facts because I was not there. The father of the girl has her there for safety and convenience not to promote naturalism in his family.

[NudeAl]

Well I would say you got caught off guard. I don't think it would have effected me the same way but that is due to having been in hundreds of social situations where nude is the norm. I can see where you are coming from though. I think I would have made a little chit chat with the dad though. You know something about how's it going something about the Y or the weather or the kids. That way you may have put the situation in a more natural context. I think you were just taken by surprise not expecting it but it shoudn't freak you out. I bet if you were to go to a nude club you would be better prepared. No biggie don't over think this, it is what it is as they say.

[connorsdad]

In the meantime you go to the Y where you know that young girls under five years of age are allowed in an area where you and your son may be nude (e.g. the shower.)..... Just one mans opinion.


Are you kidding me? You think that I go to the Y thinking that I am going to run into this situation? I know it exist, but I do not ever expect it. And it has never been an issue before, most of the time when I used to belong to the Y, I was clothed, swim trunks etc. and never thought twice about it if a young girl and her dad were in there. This time it was just "odd".

[Lord Drakkus]

I agree with shanghaist. It was simply an unfamiliar situation and, once you have more experience in situations like this, it won't be such a big deal.

I haven't had many experiences with "social nudism" so far either. If I was showering in the mens locker room and a young girl walked in and stripped down herself, I would think it a little strange. But, I also know that there's nothing wrong with seeing a girl of that age in the nude, nor is there anything wrong with her seeing you nude.

Just shrug it off, go to a few resorts/beaches/events whatever, and you'll be fine. The strangeness will wear off after a while, and eventually you won't think anything of it.

[Ren]

When I went in there was a young boy at the urinal, alone. I closed the door and waited outside until he was finished.

This is a sidetrack, but I don't feel it warrants its own topic since this reminded me of something. When I travel, I go into rest stops. More and more, when I stop in the men's room, if there's a boy age 5 and under, I guess, using a urinal, he has his pants and underwear down to his ankles. This is completely foreign to me, since I was taught how to use a urinal without disrobing when I was a kid and was pretty much incident-free.

What kind of technique is this? And when did it suddenly become the norm?

[jennan32za]

I've been in the locker room, in the gang shower, when the middle school aged boys swimming team is showering before or after swim team pracice. There have been small girls in there, also. Sometimes the boys freak out. I just go on as if the girls aren't there.

This sort of thing annoys me - when I was that age, it was freaky enough getting undressed in a locker room in front of your peers without having little girls running around in there as well. Even though it theoretically is nothing to be concerned about, there is no way I would have been able to shower there at that age if this sort of thing is the norm. It's no wonder younger guys are hung up on getting undressed where they can be seen.

There are few things I feel this passionate about, but having kids of the opposite sex in a locker room is one of them. My gym has a little-known policy regarding this, and it is that only kids under 2 can go into the opposite-sex locker room with a parent. It's not advertised at the gym but is in the fine print, according to the gym spokesman after there was a complaint, but I've never been in there with a girl present.

When I was little, my mom would wait right outside the door when I got changed at the swimming pools; never was I taken into the ladies' locker room. A nude beach is clearly another story, because you expect to see both genders there. You don't expect to see both genders in gender-specific locker rooms.

-d-

[sdson]

When I was little, my mom would wait right outside the door when I got changed at the swimming pools; never was I taken into the ladies' locker room. A nude beach is clearly another story, because you expect to see both genders there. You don't expect to see both genders in gender-specific locker rooms.

-d-[/QUOTE]

Well said. This is a viable option to bringing opposite gender kids into locker rooms with their parents. The other options include family changing rooms (I've seen these at some Y's), and changing and showering at home to avoid the locker rooms altogether. Another compromise is changing in a locker room cubicle with your child. I also agree that age two and under of opposite gender in the locker room seems more appropriate. Another activity I've seen at the Y is parents undressing their children in the public pool area. I believe this is inappropriate as well; that's what the locker rooms are for.

Personally, I dislike being stared at when I'm naked. I understand that with kids its curiosity but their staring still makes me feel uncomfortable. This is one of the reasons the nudist resorts are preferable to me; because people don't stare.

The other issue is being falsely accused of inappropriate behavior. In the few times I've experienced opposite gender kids in the men's locker room I covered up, took all of my stuff out of the locker and moved to another location to finish getting dressed. Other additional precautions to avoid accusations of inappropriate behavior include not initating conversations with those I don't know and quickly showering and getting out of open showers that are not in cubicles. My primary goal is to protect myself for any misperceptions that could lead to false accusations.

I am by no means shy about nudity where it is common, accepted, and less apt to be mispercieved as inappropriate. I am usually the first one out of his clothes at a nudist resort of beach.

[walter05]

When boys are just learning, the length of time from when they are aware of the need to urinate and urinating is very small. Having them pull their pants down is faster.

You may not remember, but I expect you did the same thing.

However, I have seen older boys up to 10 doing the same thing. My theory is that they were not raised with a father or brother in the house. I imagine it is difficult for a woman to explain the logistics of unzipping, taking a penis out, and aiming.

If the boy sees his father or brother doing that at a men's room, the example is enough. After a short time, he will start to do so. That is what happened with both of my boys.

[Georgia_Nude]

When boys are just learning, the length of time from when they are aware of the need to urinate and urinating is very small. Having them pull their pants down is faster.

You may not remember, but I expect you did the same thing.

However, I have seen older boys up to 10 doing the same thing. My theory is that they were not raised with a father or brother in the house. I imagine it is difficult for a woman to explain the logistics of unzipping, taking a penis out, and aiming.

If the boy sees his father or brother doing that at a men's room, the example is enough. After a short time, he will start to do so. That is what happened with both of my boys.



Well remember though that by first grade the kids are usually peeing in front of each other in school anyway. My first, second grade classrooms (1980 - 1982 ) had one bathroom each for each of the sexes, but doors separated the two classrooms; in other words, you could move from one classroom to another if you felt inclined enough to do it through the bathroom. In the boy's bathroom at least, we had a sink and a single toilet - no door, just an old toilet in the back. We learned it was quicker to circle the toilet and aim. Then the bathroom for third, fourth grade had urinals without partitions. So by the time a boy is about five or six, he's probably gotten used to how things work and used to doing everything with others.

[Nude_Eric]

I agree that I would be a little uncomfortable in the setting described. I would probably ignore the young girl and get showered and dressed.

I belong to a nudist resort and I can say from experience that you will not get the same reaction from the younger kids that have had the opportunity to be around other adults of the opposite sex.

I hope this isolated experience won't keep you and your son from trying social nudism. Belonging to a nudist resort has been a very relaxing and bonding experience for me and my son.


Eric

[Lord Drakkus]

I was just thinking... I have a 2 year old son, and he's used to seeing me in the nude. Been seeing me so almost daily since the day he was born. He still stares on occasion, although I can't understand why. He has a penis, I have a penis, why should he stare? Anyway, I admit that it's a little wierd, but I've learned to ignore it. As long as he doesn't try touching, I see no harm in it. For some reason, he's just highly interested in what they do, how they move, etc. He'll get over it, as I have, and eventually it'll be no big deal for him, as it's no longer a problem for me.

Hang in there buddy, pun intended. You'll get over the staring pretty quickly and be able to laugh and go on about your business, as I do.

[Fitz1980]

I've been in that situation before, or at least one like it. I was showering off in a restroom at a beachfront resort. The way the place was set up the showers were right beside the door and you had to walk right passed them to get to the toilet, benches or sinks. I was showering and a man came in with his little girl. It didn't really bother me and she didn't seem to care either. If anything the father seemed a bit flustered as it was midday, there wasn't much activity and I don't think he was expecting my naked body to be the first thing he saw when he entered the place. He quickly ushered her past the showers and than I got dressed and left. I don't think he was worried about her seeing male nudity but probably didn't want to make me uncomfortable. I wasn't and we all just went about our business.

As for feeling uncomfortable in that situation it's does happen. Usually the genders are reversed. I've seen several posts on textile websites from women who are uncomfortable with little boys who's Moms bring them into the lady's locker room. They feel that the boys are getting a thrill by looking at their bodies as they change or shower but I think it's all in these woman's minds as 5 year old boys certainly don't have sexual urges. Usually on those arguments mothers will chime in saying something to the effect of "sorry if you are uncomfortable but if the choice is sending my little boy alone into a men's room where some sexual predator could snatch him up and you being embarrassed because a 5 year old saw your bare boobs, tough luck for you." I can't say that I disagree with that. I don't have any kids of my own yet but if I had a little girl I'd bring her into the men's room before sending her into the lady's room alone.

If a little kid is looking at things anyway it's just childhood curiosity and not a dirty sexual thing anyway. At that age kids are practically androgynous anyway. Kids do like to innocently observe anything around them simply because it's in their nature. If that had been a little boy looking at you as you changed would you have felt better or worse? I've even heard stories about situations where mothers were left red faced after their little girl made some comment about another woman in the locker room being fat or having saggy boobs. The kid didn't mean anything offensive and though that they were just making an observation.

[walter05]

A two year old boy might be toilet training or about to.

Right now, he is focusing on how to use his to urinate. Naturally, as a result, he is fascinated with your penis.

This is normal.

[Skinview]

What actually does this mean? Does this mean that I will never be comfortable in a nudist resort / situation? Or was it a normal response and others would have felt the same way? It was kind of a wake up call.

Any thoughts? Thanks.

I would guess you are anxious because society has a fit if men expose themselves to little girls. You'd be busted, ostracized, put on a list, do time in prison, etc. Part of your brain is screaming danger! Just keep remiding yourself that you are in a men's locker room, and not in a kiddie park. You will get used to it. Don't let the rest of the world make you as wacko as it is.

[Gunther Netzer]

I have been in a similar position at our local pool. I went for a swim one afternoon when it was quiet (only a few people in there) and there was a man with his 14 or 15 year old daughter and her friend in the pool. I got out once I'd swum a few lengths of the pool, went to my locker, took my trunks off and walked back to the shower (which is right next to the entrance/exit to the pool with my shower gel/shampoo. I was under the shower and the guy walked in and took his trunks off and got under the shower. Just as I was washing my hair and he was washing his, I heard a girl's voice right next to where I was standing. It was the guy's daughter and her friend giggling and asking if they could have his shower gel. They had obviously been standing there for a few seconds. He screamed for them to get out and they ran out giggling. He was very, very angry and couldn't stop apologising to me, which I said I accepted and he said it had never happened before and cetainly wouldn't again. I put this down to a prank or a dare but, all the same, very foolish.

I have decided not to use that pool again after another incident a few weeks later. I did the same with my shower and as I was walking to the shower with nothing on and just holding my gel, a group of about six 13-14 year old girls came running towards me shouting and screaming, ran past me and out of the door into the corridor and back into the women's changing room. It seems that they had done it for a laugh, but the school has been warned about any similar incidents occurring in the future.

[nudistjeff]

I think your response sounds pretty normal. Just think about it this way: she's probably curious. After getting used to the locker room she won't care any more.

[mlrm201]

My YMCA has separate rooms with individual showers for fathers with young daughters or mothers with young sons. That way, no embarrassment for anybody.

[Nudistfan2001]

Kids are not bother by nudity they are just curious that all. It Is same way at the Jewish Community Centers(JCC). They have Family Rooms Men and Woman locker room but i think it apply as the same as just like YMCA.

[dundeenaturist]

I agree that it was simply a childs curiosity, no need for concern

[countryguy]

i feel that if you ar euncomfortable in any way, and you feel that you should say something the go for it

[emsdude]

We have family room at the YMCA i go to , and some times dad's bring their young daughters in the men's locker room. Too go for family swim and act like it's now big deal.If your naked, and the fathers shower with their daughters no big deal naked. It all what it make it to be.

[RalphVa]

I'd have gone about changing clothes as usual.

We're a silly society to have to have separate (3rd) change rooms for those with children or those changing out a dirty diaper. Pretty soon, do we have separate rooms for the lesbians and gays? I'd be more uncomfortable if one of them were giving me the eye rather than a small child. Those older than children generally have learned how to look without staring though.

[steve-o]

ConnersDad, I would try to push yourself to get use to this situation. Everyone there is nude so you are all in a nude environment exactly like at a nude resort. And just like at a nude resort, kids will be naturally curious. I've seen a lot of young girls, even teens, staring when at my local c/o resort. Don't be uncomfortable or embarrassed with it when you're not doing anything wrong. It's completely natural childhood curiosity.

--steve

[aus_skin]

Steve-0, do you think it could be called natural curiosity for female teens? Surely that is a little more than natural curiosity.

[Fitz1980]

Steve-0, do you think it could be called natural curiosity for female teens? Surely that is a little more than natural curiosity.

I wouldn't say that. Girls wonder about the male body too; I'd say to some degree more so than boys about girls. Boobs are everywhere, from cleavage, to flashing, to Hollywood movies. On the other hand many teen girls haven't seen many penises outside of changing baby diapers and they wonder. I used to work with a guy who was uncircumcised and quite the lady's man. Hearing it from some of the girls that he hooked up with they had never seen an uncircumcised penis, and these were sexually active college girls.

[null]

I'm with those that said no big deal and just carry on as one normally would.

I swim and in the locker room there is a communal shower room. When there is swim program for kids and their parents we would get fathers with young children in the shower room. Every now and then we get a father with a young girl in there and no one cares. We just know there are kids around and to be careful not to back in to them. You know how kids are: full of energy and all over the place even after a swim session.