Former "nudist" resort gives nudism a black eye

[Naturist Mark]

This is why we object so strongly to sex clubs calling themselves "nudist resorts". Or "colonies"!
<blockquote>
Sex party swingers in mini riot over clothed guest at nudist colony (http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,25140373-952,00.html)

By Peter Michael

March 04, 2009 11:00pm

A TOURIST who refused to take his clothes off at a swinger sex party has been blamed for "a mini-riot" at a north Queensland nudist colony.

Police were called amid threats of violence and lewd behaviour and ordered the Brisbane man and his wife from the adults-only "anything goes" sex party.

The White Cockatoo resort at Mossman, near Port Douglas, is promoting swingers and sex parties in a month of hedonism for March in a bid to boost sagging tourism figures.

Once billed as the nation's top group-sex hotspot for swingers, the resort made international headlines last year when The Courier-Mail first reported plans to lift a self-imposed swinger ban.

Owner Tony Fox said the "mini-riot" erupted when four naked female guests protested when confronted by the fully-clothed man.

"They felt uncomfortable with him eyeing them off and I asked him to show some respect and take his clothes off," said the nudist colony manager.

"He then threatened to bash me, there was some argy-bargy and I ordered him off the premises and police were called."</blockquote>

And you gotta love one of the comments: "How can you read this and not think that nudists are perverts?"

[Lord Drakkus]

Why am I not surprised that this comes from the White Cockatoo? That resort is getting to be more and more of a blemish over the years.

First it was just rumors of bad management, and now they've gone to full-scale hedonistic sex parties... This place needs to either clean up or stop calling itself a nudist resort.

Actually, are there any more nudists that even go there? I know for sure that I never will.

[tiger79]

Interestingly, the press coverage in the UK included a photo of the clothed man and his wife - see here (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article2295425.ece) - not sure if they look like swingers (although I guess I'm not sure what swingers look like anyway!) Also note that this UK paper didn't lead on the "nudist" aspect, although at the end of the piece it did quote the "nudist colony manager".

[ThalUtat]

It's just another example of how quickly tolerating swinging turns into embracing swinging because it's "go-for-business." Before you know it, we've sold the heart-and-soul of both nudism and naturism out to serve the philosophical interests completely at odds with the philosophies most of us here profess.

Slippery slope anyone?

It reminds me of Nicky Hoffman's editorial in the most recent issue of Nude & Natural, but I'm planning on starting a separate thread on that soon (I want to choose the most concise quote and to out my thoughts together on it).

Bill
Long Island

[Pete Knight]

No surprise that Tony Fox has caused a rumpus yet again, he doesn't care what he does as long as he makes money, he can't seem to do that as either a textile resort or a nudist resort, and seems to be having trouble as a swingers resort too!

The sooner he goes out of business the better.

Pete Knight

[Pumpkinpie]

They will always give us a bad name no matter what, I had told a friend of mines many years ago that I am a nudist she called me every name in the book, and she kept her kids away from me, and told everyone that I am a pervert, not knowing the people she told is nudist just like me she sure enough got a belly full from all of us to last her a life time,years passed on and now two of her kids are nudist and they raised their kids the same,she don't have anything to do with them or her grand kids stupidity and ignorance is a bliss.
You cannot please anyone but yourself, and people who is in the same lifestyle as us have better knowledge of being and knows what being a nudist is all about, and there are many that gives us a lable and sees us as perverts and get us confuse with others,I for one don't really care cause I know who and what I am and happy with my life,they need to accept it bottom line we are all children of "God"

[Running Bear]

It's just another example of how quickly tolerating swinging turns into embracing swinging because it's "go-for-business." Before you know it, we've sold the heart-and-soul of both nudism and naturism out to serve the philosophical interests completely at odds with the philosophies most of us here profess.

Slippery slope anyone?

Long Island
I think the average swinger would be highly offended by this case. To judge all swingers by the reaction of one individual is wrong. We all know the weird naturist we are ashamed of that gives all naturists a bad name.
Be realistic this is gutter press embellishment making a mountain out of a molehill. Good stories like this sell papers and have nothing to do with reality.

As a naturist I can see three lady naturists offended by a textile voyeur (sometimes called a meerkat) and the organisers evicting said member. It occurs all the time in a naturist club. Just replace the word naturist with swinger and we are the same.

One bad apple does not make the whole pile rotten.

[Oldman]

I think the average swinger would be highly offended by this case. To judge all swingers by the reaction of one individual is wrong. We all know the weird naturist we are ashamed of that gives all naturists a bad name.
Be realistic this is gutter press embellishment making a mountain out of a molehill. Good stories like this sell papers and have nothing to do with reality.

As a naturist I can see three lady naturists offended by a textile voyeur (sometimes called a meerkat) and the organisers evicting said member. It occurs all the time in a naturist club. Just replace the word naturist with swinger and we are the same.

One bad apple does not make the whole pile rotten.

We had a case as you suggest above a few years back. I had to throw a guy out for rude behaviour. He was harassing a newby nudist woman, because she was wearing a bathing suit bottom, and he wanted her to get nude. She had only been out of the car for less than 1/2 hour on her first nudist experience. She complained to me about him, I tossed him, problem solved. As you said, just replace swinger with naturist. Bad behaviour occurs with any group.

[Pete Knight]

I think the average swinger would be highly offended by this case. To judge all swingers by the reaction of one individual is wrong. We all know the weird naturist we are ashamed of that gives all naturists a bad name.
Be realistic this is gutter press embellishment making a mountain out of a molehill. Good stories like this sell papers and have nothing to do with reality.

As a naturist I can see three lady naturists offended by a textile voyeur (sometimes called a meerkat) and the organisers evicting said member. It occurs all the time in a naturist club. Just replace the word naturist with swinger and we are the same.

One bad apple does not make the whole pile rotten.

Graham, I don't think you understand, this guy Tony Fox, the proprietor of 'The White **** or Two' claims to run a nudist establishment, but for the month of March it is a swingers resort. This confuses textiles, or confirms their suspicion that nudism is about more than simple nudity. He shouldn't claim to be something he isn't, if he wants to run a swingers resort he should call it a swingers resort, real nudist resorts such as Pacific Sun Friends further down the coast will suffer as a result.

I have no problems with swingers, if that's what they want to do then fine, but don't hide behind the good name of nudism or naturism. A wolf in sheep's clothing. Organisations such as CCBN and ANRR spend thousands trying to convince the general populace that nudism is a wholesome family activity, then idiots like tony Fox come along and wipe all that aside.

These are swingers clubs (http://www.punterlink.co.uk/swingers-clubs.htm), and quite open about it, not hiding or pretending to be something they are not.

Pete Knight

[Stu2630]

It is my experience that most people know perfectly well that there is a world of difference between lifestyle nudists like yourselves and the sort of people who are into swinging and sex parties.

I really don't think anyone here need worry about the reputation of nudism from a story like this.

Stu

[nickuma09]

I have no problems with swingers, if that's what they want to do then fine, but don't hide behind the good name of nudism or naturism. A wolf in sheep's clothing. Organisations such as CCBN and ANRR spend thousands trying to convince the general populace that nudism is a wholesome family activity, then idiots like tony Fox come along and wipe all that aside.

I agree. It seems there are two issues: whether swingers themselves are directly ruining the perception of the nudist lifestyle which some claim (but I don't believe) vs. resort owners who are maintaining the nudist/clothing optional/'non' traditional nudist labels while in reality operating sex resorts.

It's a dishonest business practice to either clientele, as some nudists will go there looking for a regular social nude experience only to be bombarded with solicitations from swingers who have gone to the same place with the promise of sex partners waiting--that's where the conflict comes in. both were sold a raw deal. the question becomes how do you hold these managers accountable for their dishonest business practices?

[Naturist Mark]

It is my experience that most people know perfectly well that there is a world of difference between lifestyle nudists like yourselves and the sort of people who are into swinging and sex parties.

I really don't think anyone here need worry about the reputation of nudism from a story like this.

Stu

The press reporting the story don't know the difference.

[Centauri4]

Sounds a bit like a case of 'Supply and Demand' and I would not be surprised to see any financially unstable resort go up for sale and become a different sort of alternative lifestyle resort.

There is an awful lot of power in the form of a "business plan" and brand loyalty that gets developed when a family oriented resort is conceived and comes into being. As with all "businesses" it takes a steady amount of income to offset the expenditures to keep the operation viable; even if it is "family owned and operated" and the founding members take little or no salary for themselves. How many of us can afford to forego a "regular paycheck" and retirement plan in favor of dedication to THE HIGHEST of moral (or lifestyle) callings?

Perhaps one day there will be a mass market Courtyard by Nuddiot Hotel chain featuring a "real" nudist getaway at 1,000 locations nationwide and complete understanding of what we are all about.

~

[Running Bear]

Well Pete I really hate to say this but I think Stu is correct and you are wrong.

I feel that most textiles do not confuse swinging and naturists. I always say when promoting naturism to read the label on the can. A nudist club can become a swingers club for a day people will see the difference the more this is done. There will always be clubs claiming to be naturist when they are swingers. That is wrong but by cooperating with them rather than fighting them that could change. A naturist club that promotes swinging can see the commercial benefits and it all comes down to business in the end.

For many years the Swedish massage business was a term used for prostitutes who saw the term was legitimate. Swinging is not illegal so there should be no need to hide behind naturist labels apart from public concerns. We have several sex shops in Taunton They are called "private shop, anne@@@ shop, adult shop, erotic underwear shop but not sex-shops. Why not call them hedonistic shops or something similar. I am confused :-)

"Do not judge otherwise you yourself may be judged."

[Running Bear]

The press reporting the story don't know the difference.
Not at all. The press know how to make money out of creating a story. They clearly know the difference but choose to ignore it to sell papers. Nobody really believes what is written in the press except you :-)

[Pete Knight]

Well Pete I really hate to say this but I think Stu is correct and you are wrong. Have you been to Queensland then Graham, I can assure you there is a misconception about nudism in Queensalnd, that's why there are no official beaches and resorts have to operate on the quiet. I made enquiries about nudist touring in Qld, and the reaction I got from the homesteads I'd planned to use wasn't favourable.

I feel that most textiles do not confuse swinging and naturists. I always say when promoting naturism to read the label on the can. A nudist club can become a swingers club for a day people will see the difference the more this is done. There will always be clubs claiming to be naturist when they are swingers. That is wrong but by cooperating with them rather than fighting them that could change. A naturist club that promotes swinging can see the commercial benefits and it all comes down to business in the end. In Europe that may be so, and even in the UK there is still a huge misconception about nudism, the old nude = sex idea!

For many years the Swedish massage business was a term used for prostitutes who saw the term was legitimate. Swinging is not illegal so there should be no need to hide behind naturist labels apart from public concerns. We have several sex shops in Taunton They are called "private shop, anne@@@ shop, adult shop, erotic underwear shop but not sex-shops. Why not call them hedonistic shops or something similar. I am confused :-)
I wish I could answer that question, but the establishments themselves are often reluctant to come out, and whilst some are quite open about what they are, tgere are some that still hide behind nudism, try visiting the Blue Lagoon Naturist Spa in Dagenham, I did, and got a shock! Why then did BN have to tackle a massage parlout that was due to open in South London, with naturist in it's name. They dropped the word naturist when approached by Chris Lamb, not all would be as amenable.

"Do not judge otherwise you yourself may be judged." I'm quite happy to be judged (And frequently am!), I'm not trying to be something that I quite obviously am not.

Pete Knight

[Pete Knight]

Not at all. The press know how to make money out of creating a story. They clearly know the difference but choose to ignore it to sell papers. Nobody really believes what is written in the press except you :-)
We're talking about Queensland here, they turn down applications for nude beaches because they think there will be people having sex all over the beach, try following the efforts of the FBA as I do, try joining several Qld nudist Yahell groups as I have.

Pete Knight

[inudist]

That these swingers continue to cloak their activities under the good name of nudism that so many people have worked so hard for is a huge problem in my opinion. I believe that it is important for nudists to clearly distinguish between the two.

I have no personal problem with swinging, but we should insist that they at least call it for what it is. We need some truth in advertising so to speak. I know a few may disagree here.

I disagree with this Stu in that I'm sure there are certainly a few non nudists that can distinguish between nudism and swinging, but a good majority don't and this article feeds into this perception.

I know many here disagree on many things (politics, religion, etc.) but hopefully everyone can stick together on this one.

[Running Bear]

I am speaking as a UK naturist. I am aware that naturism is different for foreigners but can only judge from my own experience. The point of an international board is that we can share knowledge and if we differ why we differ. I bow to my friend Albatross Pete who seems to wander widely and can fill in my gaps. I still see or hear nothing that makes me change my opinion however I do accept that I may be wrong. It is only an opinion as I see it.

[Fitz1980]

Well Pete I really hate to say this but I think Stu is correct and you are wrong.

I feel that most textiles do not confuse swinging and naturists.

I disagree on that point. Here on this very board there was recently a post that linked to some blogger who was horrified to find that a picture that showed that her grandparents and prepubescent mother & aunt had once visited a 'nudist colony' back in the 50s. By the end of the post she was making speculations about her grandparents being part of a 'key party.' For those of you who don't know key parties are mythical moral panic stories about groups of swingers who get together throw their house/room keys in a bowl and the wives go back to the room of whosoever key they got. In fact one of her readers even commented that as he was reading the story he was planning on leaving a comment suggesting that her grandparents could have been swingers too but she beat him to it.



For many years the Swedish massage business was a term used for prostitutes who saw the term was legitimate. Swinging is not illegal so there should be no need to hide behind naturist labels apart from public concerns. We have several sex shops in Taunton They are called "private shop, anne@@@ shop, adult shop, erotic underwear shop but not sex-shops. Why not call them hedonistic shops or something similar. I am confused :-)


Swinging is not illegal but getting permission to set up such a business can be hard. I used to have a friend who worked in a shop that sold sex toys, porn and drug paraphernalia. She said that they were officially called an 'adult novelty' shop because selling sex toys in Cobb County, Georgia is illegal. They can sell 'personal massagers' which just happen to be in the shape of a penis but they can not sell 'sex toys.' Similarly it may be easier to get permission to open up a 'nudist club' than to open up a swingers club.