Message to all about harassing others

[Corky]

It has come to my attention that many paying INA members are being abused in the forums. Please do not nit pick or abuse others. No personal attacks. Certain "comedians" are causing others to be uncofortable and causing them to leave the forums. Please let's concentrate on the one goal we all have and that is the joy of nude recreation.

I have instructed other monitors of these forums to delete posts that contain personal attacks right as they arrive. Or even block the user.

We are considering making the forums open only to paying INA members or setting up two forums, one for all, one for INA members only. We will wait and see.

We only want the best for everyone involved and strive to have the best place online to exchange ideas about nudism and so all of us can keep in touch and talk about nudism, plan events, and so on.

Thank you!

Corky Stanton
INA Staff
559-683-2388

[Corky]

It has come to my attention that many paying INA members are being abused in the forums. Please do not nit pick or abuse others. No personal attacks. Certain "comedians" are causing others to be uncofortable and causing them to leave the forums. Please let's concentrate on the one goal we all have and that is the joy of nude recreation.

I have instructed other monitors of these forums to delete posts that contain personal attacks right as they arrive. Or even block the user.

We are considering making the forums open only to paying INA members or setting up two forums, one for all, one for INA members only. We will wait and see.

We only want the best for everyone involved and strive to have the best place online to exchange ideas about nudism and so all of us can keep in touch and talk about nudism, plan events, and so on.

Thank you!

Corky Stanton
INA Staff
559-683-2388

[Snoboy]

That is an excellent suggestion. I hope you go forward with the changes soon.

I fully agree with deleting any and all personal attacks. There is NO excuse for rudeness. I am no longer a paying INA member because the only thing I can't get into are the photos, and they're not something I want to pay to see.

If non-paying people are banned from the forum, then that leaves me out, but I'm sure there are those who won't care one way or the other if I'm not there. Most of what is posted is so boring that I don't read it anyway. I enjoy the forum because it gives me something to do in my spare time. Since I'm retired, I have a LOT of spare time.

Let me rephrase something. There is no excuse for rudeness unless you're dealing with someone who won't take "No" for an answer. Unfortunately, sometimes you HAVE to be rude to people who keep at you after you've politely said "No". I was referring to people who are just naturally rude for no good reason when kindness would work perfectly well. There's not enough kindness in the world.

[Gary Naturist]

In addition to deleting posts, you might want to consider suspending people after repeated offenses and eventually expelling them.

Re forums for paying members only: you would lose your casual visitors including many who are not yet involved in nudism but are curious and have questions. Would be a shame.

Gary

[tarsus]

everyone
i agree some of the stuff is nothing short of attacks. i love comedy and would do almost anything for five minutes with leno. i am not a paying member but have considered it so i can see
the newscast on this site.lets lighten up we are here by choice.we are guests on this site and should act the part, paying or non paying.

[Snoboy]

Bartamus, Gary Naturist has a good point. I agree with him that losing the non-paying members would be unfortunate because for some of them, it is a way to learn about our lifestyle and experience nudism for theirselves. I just don't want to see repeated attacks of individuals within the forum any longer. There is no good reason that I know of that justifies hurting people. As for me, I love people of all ages, cultures and lifestyles and believe in lifting the hearts of people. There is more than enough negative input in our lives without having it in here as well. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[CalgaryMark]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Re forums for paying members only: you would lose your casual visitors including many who are not yet involved in nudism but are curious and have questions. Would be a shame.

Gary [/QB] <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I agree with Gary; I have been a reader and 'learner' here for a long time, and registered to post only recently. I don't post much as most of it has been said by others, and I have precious little experience to draw on. "It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to open one's mouth (keyboard?) and remove all doubt".

I do agree that restraint is needed by posters - after all, this is like shouting in the market place, all can hear/read what is being said. Corky, If censorship is needed, I suggest just deleting the attacks and inserting a (deleted by admin.) remark, so all can see who is doing it, but not what was said or written, leaving the rest of the text for all to see.

There are also the off-topic threads, and these can be used for letting off steam.

I would insert a plea to all, to stick with the theme of naturism or nudism in the rest of the board. Of the several boards I look at, this is by far the most lively and informative, and I appreciate that. Congratulations to INA for what you have created.

CalgaryMark.

[Corky]

Thank you CalgaryMark!
We will keep the forums open to all and monitor it heavily and block any offenders.
Have fun!
Corky

[Falcon46]

Corky,
I'm glad to hear the boards will be kept open for all. Most things worthwhile require some extra effort at times, and these boards certainly apply as worthwhile. With the extra effort in monitoring attacks, the boards can only get better and keep you heads above the rest. Keep up the good work!

I will reinterate Jon-Marc's point though about keeping an eye out for those that serve to disrupt or promote attacks. Most that have been around here for any length of time have seen them on occasion, and I personally find them just as bad as their so called "attackers". It's a double-sided issue at times in my humble opinion.

One of the greatest freedoms we enjoy is the right to disagree... it's unfortunate that some can't seem to be adult about it.

[Trailscout]

Corky,

Bart has been curtailing debate in a way I have not seen in my two years on this forum.
It flies in the face of what INA is supposed to stand for.

If INA is a national naturist organization, it is about time that members participate freely in discussing INA's direction and overall philosophy about naturism. Demands that we curtail a debate that you or Bart don't find interesting enough reflects your unwillingness to share power in this organization.

If Bart, with your blessing starts labelling some topics boring and stiffling the free exchange of ideas, he is exceeding his responsibilities as a hired Web consultant. If that weren't galling enough, INA has several topic categories and multiple threads under each one. If you don't like a topic, fine! Ignore it and read the 20 odd other topics you do like.

As INA keeps growing, you and your small band of boys barely old enough to shave will no longer have the time or resources to manage it properly without national participation of rank and file members or at least elected representatives.
What worked when you were small won't cut it now.
As you grow in visibility and capital, you are also accountable for your expenditures in a greater way. I have seen no intent to publish your balance or annual report. Granted you may not be legally obligated to do so, but as thousands of member dollars flow in, members should begin to demand to see where this money is going.

[Corky]

Thank you Trailscout,

I want people to participate freely in discussing INA's direction. Bart is a volunteer and will never delete a post just for being boring, but he does have a right to his opinion. We appreciate his help. Plus we value your opinion too.

INA is growing very fast, especially since we added the Nudes in the News webcast. In a nutshell, 99% of the INA's money comes from memberships. Almost all of it goes back into the business to cover the cost of video production, paying the staff in the office, photographers, plane tickets, bandwidth, computers, brochures, promotional items, legal fees, etc. Without our paying members, we cannot have these forums, the websites including the NudistExplorer.com search engine, the videos or promote this great lifestyle.

We do attract the younger generation a lot more than some other nudist organizations do. I think that is one reason why we will grow even faster. Nudism will die out if the younger generation doesn't get involved. Corey, INA president and webmaster, and most of the workers here are in their early 20's and know how to appeal to people their own age. But, at the same time, they don't have years of experience in business. I am a forum monitor and a webmaster for INA. I happen to be 48. But Corey has a better business mind than many 40 year olds. I am amazed at how dedicated the people are here. We plan to grow a lot more and welcome volunteers to help us.

And thank you Falcon46!

[luvnaturism]

I'm one of the early people to find this forum. I was here when it was unmoderated, and it was B-A-A-A-D. Switching to a moderated forum with firm insistance that posts be respectful and appropriate saved the day, and allowed the forum to grow and flourish.

IMHO [actually you can leave out the "H"; I've never been humble about anything /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif ] people lose sight of the fact that any forum belongs to its owner?to the person or crew who does the day to day work of keeping it going and paying the bills. That ownership also carries responsibilities that those of those who do nothing but post do not have.

Posts that engage in endless?sometimes insulting?arguments are always boring and may be offensive. Many interesting threads have been hijacked by juvenile humor or unrestrained anger. Those who do it are no doubt enjoying themselves, but it comes at a price that is paid by every other user.

My view is that those who feel entitled to post anything they choose, no matter how poorly considered, are entitled to do just that on any web site that they themselves own and operate. Apart from that we're all just guests here, and Corky and the rest of the crew get to set the rules.

Now, it's a beautiful day here in California. Let's all go get naked and relax. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[Trailscout]

Luvnaturism,

I strongly disagree with you.

This is not just a forum, but a group that aspires to be a national or even international nudist society.

If they truly grow national in scope, it would be a terrible mistake for a small group of founders to make all the decisions. Dispite their best intentions, their social and ethnic backgrounds will leave them with blindspots as they try to administer policies for the benefit of a multi-cultural multiracial transnational organization.

Sorry, business as usual won't fly. Adapting your business model to growth is one of the basic principles of survival. I am surprized that you don't see that.

[David77]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by luvnaturism:
"People lose sight of the fact that any forum belongs to its owner?to the person or crew who does the day to day work of keeping it going and paying the bills. That ownership also carries responsibilities that those .. who do nothing but post do not have".
<hr width="35%" />
"My view is that those who feel entitled to post anything they choose, no matter how poorly considered, are entitled to do just that on any web site that they themselves own and operate. Apart from that we're all just guests here, and Corky and the rest of the crew get to set the rules".
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE><font color = "800000">How very true! </font>

[Bartamus]

Luvnaturism and David77: Thank you both for your
kind and supportive statements. You guys have
been with us for a long time and we're very glad
you have a handle on what this forum is all about. I'm sorry Trailscout is under the impression that we are ready to be a corporation with an elected board of directors. I wish we were, but we're not. No one would be more supportive of that than me..I could get a raise!
In the meantime this forum will continue to be run by INA and not the contributors. I know that's sad news to some, but better for all. Thanks once again to all who support us.

[Trailscout]

Bart,

You can learn more from people who disagree with you and suggest alternatives than people who want to kick back and let you make all the decisions. I am not talking about just myself, but the thousands of people from all over the world who would like to push INA beyond being a for-profit Web site with an admirable agenda, to becoming a naturist society in every sense of the word.

If you have no plan in place to grow beyond a mere Website, then you will never be what you yourself aspire to. I don't see any hidden costs in sharing the decision-making and work load with a worldwide membership. I have not and will not suggest a specific optimum point at which you should incorporate and function on every level as a naturist society. But I will observe that a much smaller group has already done so. Bill Martin's name should be familiar to you. His naturist group has lower income and lower numbers of members than INA, but already has a governing board, a charter, and is incorporated as a non-profit.

Would it really kill you to at least have an annual meeting?

I hope you are not afraid of losing control of INA. I contend that if you don't change the status quo, you will lose control of it without us.

[luvnaturism]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Trailscout:
Luvnaturism,

I strongly disagree with you.

This is not just a forum, but a group that aspires to be a national or even international nudist society.

If they truly grow national in scope, it would be a terrible mistake for a small group of founders to make all the decisions. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Disagree away. Not only is it your right, but differences of opinions appropriately expressed make for lively forums. Count me as the very first to support your right to be wrong. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_razz.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

Rush Limbaugh conducts a different sort of forum, but it's a forum nevertheless. Whether either of us agrees with his politics has no importance, but let's note together that he has created and maintained for many years the most popular show in the history of talk radio.

Who selects the content of that show? On Fridays listeners can call in and talk about whatever they want, provided they have first succeeded in convincing the call screener that their topic is of general interest. On the other four days Rush sets the topics, and if that's not what someone wants to talk about...tough. "It's my show, and I get to decide what's talked about here."

It's a general truth of leadership that the larger the number of people who are being reached, the more likely there is to be a central leader or leadership team making key decisions. This forum may not have a Board of Directors, but it clearly has a leadership team working off the same page. This is a fundamental requirement for reaching a large number of people.

[Corky]

Thank you luvnaturism!

Hi Trailscout,

We do have informal meetings all the time at every event we go to. Plus, of course, we have informal meetings here at the INA forums daily.

I would like to have an annual meeting sometime. It will take a lot of planning to get everyone involved to be there in person at the same time and place. The internet allows us to meet here 24 hours a day! We will work towards an annual physical meeting soon though.

Many of us here happen to make our living from INA. We live very modest. Our main concern is to make INA financially stronger so it can take better care of us in the future. In order for that to happen, INA has to become a powerful force and take care of all its members needs and speaking out for them to protect their lifestyle. That has to be the main goal, after that, INA will take care of us.

Hope to meet all of you soon!
Corky

[luvnaturism]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Corky:

Many of us here happen to make our living from INA. We live very modest. Our main concern is to make INA financially stronger so it can take better care of us in the future. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Corky, I have assumed that INA was a non-profit corporation. However, that may be wrong. Your comment sounds as though INA is a privately owned business. Is that correct?

[Corky]

Yes, it is privately owned. Just like The Naturist Society is, and so is Naturally Magazine and many nudist clubs throughout the world. Our members have a strong voice and influence the decisions here all the time.

The main reason we started INA was to promote naturism on the internet. At the same time it takes money to run it and make it grow. Believe me, after all the expenses, there is not much money left for the salaries. But memberships are rising fast.

[luvnaturism]

I just recently learned that The Naturist Society is privately owned when we were at Terra Cotta Inn. Until then I had made the same assumption that it was a non-profit organization.

Private ownership isn't a negative to me, though I think a disclosure statement someplace on the web site would be good to have. Selling "memberships" creates a certain set of expections, at least for me.

Having this now disclosed ought to forever settle any questions about the right of the owners to make whatever rules they wish. In the best tradition of free enterprise if you make good decisions your business will grow, and if you don't eventually there won't be a business.

[Rik]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Corky:
Many of us here happen to make our living from INA. We live very modest. Our main concern is to make INA financially stronger so it can take better care of us in the future. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Corky,

Now don't get me wrong, I applaud anyone who can make a living from naturism but your comment suggests that self interest is the motivating factor for the existence of INA rather than any wider issue of promoting naturism for its own sake.

Maybe this goes some way to explain some of the unfathomable things which we've been seeing just lately on this board such as the ignoring of a number of complaints about sexual or genital-centric topics whilst "reigning in" discussions on legitimate naturist issues because the posts are too long and the subject matter is "boring".

My take on this is that you are looking to provide a discussion board which will attract those who are most likely to join INA for the main, if not sole, purpose of accessing nude photos which you have previously conceded is a money-spinner. Your membership deal certainly encourages those who merely wish to see photos and you emphasize this when you say "Unless you signed up to receive Naturally Magazine, nothing will ever be sent to you in the mail." Your members can even print off their own membership card but I wonder how many actually bother to do so even though the number one reason given in your "Member Benefits" section is "Attractive Membership Card". /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

On one level I really admire the work you do and I've said so publicly on this and other forums but as your business grows I find myself getting more confused as to what it's really about. I'm not an INA member as I cannot figure out how any of the stated benefits would benefit me so perhaps my opinion is of no worth to you but I feel, nevertheless, I should point out the truism that ultimately you will get the membership you deserve.

Again, let me emphasize that this is not so much a criticism but an observation for if you can make make a living out of it then I think that's just great. But if a large proportion of your membership is motivated by sex behind the camourflage of naturism, then you may wish to be more honest about it.


Rik

[Corky]

You are taking my comment out of context. Read the next sentence:
"In order for that to happen, INA has to become a powerful force and take care of all its members needs and speaking out for them to protect their lifestyle."
That is the main goal.
Thanks!

[Rik]

But what is the "lifestyle" of your members that you seek to protect? The lifestyle should be naturism but how many of your members do you suppose are naturists?

And why do you continue to ignore the issue of sexually orientated topics?

Rik

[Corky]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Rik:
But what is the "lifestyle" of your members that you seek to protect? The lifestyle should be naturism but how many of your members do you suppose are naturists?

And why do you continue to ignore the issue of sexually orientated topics?

Rik <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Thanks Rik!
The lifestyle is naturism, pure an simple.

We have definitely "converted" non-naturists into naturists by educating them here.

We don't ignore sexually oriented topics. It is okay for new people to ask questions that might be sexual because new naturists do that a lot and need to know, they are uninformed. They need to know that sex has nothing to do with nude recreation. That is usually the end of it. In these forums we can make it clearer as to where to draw the line.

I always delete posts that appear to be inappropriate. Please let me know if you see a post or bad thread that we might have missed. I don't read everything all the time. Please click on "Report Post" at the bottom of a bad post. People click on that only about 2 to 3 times a month and we always take action. Thanks!

Hope to meet you soon!