Feds. want nationwide screening.

[R.M. Greenman]

O.K. I wanted to report this to you all earlier, but I was having problems with my connection. If someone has already started a discussion on this already, I'm sorry to waste space. I haven't taken the time to read through all the posts since Monday.

I just happened to be home early Tues. and caught the John Walsh show, partially into it, and noticed that they were talking about Nudist Teen Camps. There were members in the audiance standing up and yelling at an avid nudist grandmother for bringing her grandkids to a resort and exposing them to this lifestyle. I was thinking,"Oh heck! Here we go again with a bunch of ill informed know-it-alls, thinking that we somehow abuse them."

Before I go further, there was a U.S. Senator there who was proposing that counsilors at the nude camps for children be given a complete federal screening before they can work at such places to weed out possible pedifiles. As I said I came in kind of late, so I do not know which senator this was or which state he represents. I also have not formed an oppinion on his plan. Did anyone else see this show or know this senator or know of this bill?

The cool thing I saw during this show was after all the ranting and raving and accussings of the audiance,(one woman was swearing up and down that her kids were better adjusted without seeing people naked than kids growing up in the lifestyle:HEY LADY! CHECK UNDER THE BEDS FOR PORNOGRAPHY!) a child research expert stood up and told the audiance that their findings showed that children raised in uor lifestyle were indeed better adjusted and more intelligent than kids that were sheltered from nudity. He believes that nudist kids weren't as easily distracted by the opposite sex while in school. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[R.M. Greenman]

O.K. I wanted to report this to you all earlier, but I was having problems with my connection. If someone has already started a discussion on this already, I'm sorry to waste space. I haven't taken the time to read through all the posts since Monday.

I just happened to be home early Tues. and caught the John Walsh show, partially into it, and noticed that they were talking about Nudist Teen Camps. There were members in the audiance standing up and yelling at an avid nudist grandmother for bringing her grandkids to a resort and exposing them to this lifestyle. I was thinking,"Oh heck! Here we go again with a bunch of ill informed know-it-alls, thinking that we somehow abuse them."

Before I go further, there was a U.S. Senator there who was proposing that counsilors at the nude camps for children be given a complete federal screening before they can work at such places to weed out possible pedifiles. As I said I came in kind of late, so I do not know which senator this was or which state he represents. I also have not formed an oppinion on his plan. Did anyone else see this show or know this senator or know of this bill?

The cool thing I saw during this show was after all the ranting and raving and accussings of the audiance,(one woman was swearing up and down that her kids were better adjusted without seeing people naked than kids growing up in the lifestyle:HEY LADY! CHECK UNDER THE BEDS FOR PORNOGRAPHY!) a child research expert stood up and told the audiance that their findings showed that children raised in uor lifestyle were indeed better adjusted and more intelligent than kids that were sheltered from nudity. He believes that nudist kids weren't as easily distracted by the opposite sex while in school. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

[florida-david]

i have no doubt that MOST kids raised nudist would be better off than non-nudists. kids should not think of the body as some sort of secret to be hidden from view. the righteous out there will never open there eyes wide enough to see the harm they are creating by shielding their kids from natural nudism. i am raising my kids nudist, but since we do not frequent a resort, i do not think i would leave them at one of the teen nudist camps because i would not be comfortable enough with the place to leave my kids alone there. heck, i probably would not leave them at any camp (nude or textile) unless i knew A LOT about the camp. most of these kids at the nude teen camp know the resort, the people running it, etc. so there is nothing wrong with them going there, and no screening is required because the owners of the resort know the people running the camp. if someone shows up out of the blue to work at the camp, than that person should be carefully screened by the resort owners and the parents of the teens in the camp should feel sure that the new counselor is a safe person. i feel this screening is happening and big brother should stay the heck out of it!!!

[Jochanaan]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by florida-david:
the righteous out there will never open there eyes wide enough to see the harm they are creating by shielding their kids from natural nudism. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Present company excepted, I trust? /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[R.M. Greenman]

I noticed that the show I was talking about is on the Nudes in the News section of this sight.

Teach me not to read that part before entering the forum! /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

[butnaked]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by R.M. Greenman:
I noticed that the show I was talking about is on the Nudes in the News section of this sight.

Teach me not to read that part before entering the forum! /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>RM We all learn, I'm still new to this BB and I'v been registered here just less than a year. If you have a chance check out the C/O digest and the past AANR The Bulletin they have both informed about the U.S. Rep. (not) Senator from Florida and the John Walsh show. /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif Happy Trails Bob

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by florida-david:
i have no doubt that MOST kids raised nudist would be better off than non-nudists. kids should not think of the body as some sort of secret to be hidden from view. the righteous out there will never open there eyes wide enough to see the harm they are creating by shielding their kids from natural nudism. i am raising my kids nudist, but since we do not frequent a resort, i do not think i would leave them at one of the teen nudist camps because i would not be comfortable enough with the place to leave my kids alone there. heck, i probably would not leave them at any camp (nude or textile) unless i knew A LOT about the camp. most of these kids at the nude teen camp know the resort, the people running it, etc. so there is nothing wrong with them going there, and no screening is required because the owners of the resort know the people running the camp. if someone shows up out of the blue to work at the camp, than that person should be carefully screened by the resort owners and the parents of the teens in the camp should feel sure that the new counselor is a safe person. i feel this screening is happening and big brother should stay the heck out of it!!! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>David, the camp is run by AANR and is frequently set up at Lake Como where I am a member. All the counselors have background checks no matter how well they are known, no child is left alone with just one counselor, they have two stay up all night every night to prevent tent creeping and people sneaking in. It is very safe and in 11 years there have been no problems at all. Most of the kids have their parents staying right at Como as well.

As for the show, the kids and parents and grandmother were all from Como and I know them all. Shirley Mason from Haulover was also on that show. All this is posted on my website.

"i have no doubt that MOST kids raised nudist would be better off than non-nudists....the righteous out there will never open there eyes wide enough to see the harm they are creating by shielding their kids from natural nudism."

David - I can't see any evidence for that assertion. My eldest daughter is 19, formerly a straight 'A' student and now a medical student at a prestigious university here. She plays sport and swims and has trophies of her successes. Now she has a regular boyfriend. During her childhood she never saw a naked adult. I have a son who is sixteen. He is in the top sets at school and is also keen on sports, especially rugby - and he showers with the other boys. He has seen naked adult men in the showers at our fitness club but freely admits he's never seen a naked woman in the flesh (though he says he lives in hope!). Our youngest is just eight years old and she is bright, intelligent, fun and open-minded. She has been brought up the same way.

All in all our kids are supremely well-adjusted and active. Thet're certainly not "harmed" by being shielded from nudity and they have no hang-ups as far as I know.

Stu

[Vin]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by cyndiann:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by florida-david:
i do not think i would leave them at one of the teen nudist camps because i would not be comfortable enough with the place to leave my kids alone there. heck, i probably would not leave them at any camp.... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>David, the camp is run by AANR and is frequently set up at Lake Como where I am a member. All the counselors have background checks no matter how well they are known, no child is left alone with just one counselor, they have two stay up all night every night to prevent tent creeping and people sneaking in..... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>David, I agree that I would never leave my kid alone at any camp -- period. That said, I recognize that there are parents who would. I would hope that any camp counselors are at least cleared through a criminal background check, like that performed on school teacher applicants. However, I also agree that Big Brother needs to stay out of it.

Cyndiann, those seem prudent practices for anyone dealing with kids. I'm glad to see Lake Como taking camper welfare seriously. I have to wonder how many textile camps take such precautions. I suspect not nearly as many as one would hope, especially day camps where the kids don't stay overnight.

Vin

I don't understand everyone's paranoia about summer camp. I went to summer camp as a teen, and no one was molested or mistreated in any way. It was a Christian camp--not nudist.

I realize that pedophiles will get themselves into any place where there's children, but should children be shielded from life for fear there might be pedophiles there? Of course, no one wants their kids to be molested, or worse, and although it could happen, I've never heard of a child being molested at a summer camp. Of course, I don't hear or read about everything that happens in the world, and I'm far from being all-knowing.

[toofeelgood]

I am glad that Cyndiann was able to share her knowledge about this. Everything that she described sets for a safe environment. The counselors are screened, there are always more than one. They stay up all night to prevent tent creeping. This all sounds fine. Although, what kind of screening is done for the counselors? and I had heard that the resorts allow regular visitors to the grounds while the camps are taking place. If this is so, then to me all the other safety methods are for not.

T.

[R.M. Greenman]

I never knew the word fear until I became a father. I would read the papers and see all the evil going on and it did not phase me too much. But becoming a father really changed that.
These days, not only am I watching my girls as closely as I can, I'm watching all the neiborhood children, taking note of any adult in the hood.
I can't help being paranoid now.

You have sickos coming into kids bedrooms at night, stealing them away, and doing things that would disgust possibly even Manson.(That's Charles).

At this point, I'm not sure I would send my girls to any kind of camp without me being near by.

I've heared stories about some really sordid things happening at even Christian Camps. It wasn't all camps, but it only takes one bad apple to question the whole barrel.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by toofeelgood:
I am glad that Cyndiann was able to share her knowledge about this. Everything that she described sets for a safe environment. The counselors are screened, there are always more than one. They stay up all night to prevent tent creeping. This all sounds fine. Although, what kind of screening is done for the counselors? and I had heard that the resorts allow regular visitors to the grounds while the camps are taking place. If this is so, then to me all the other safety methods are for not.

T. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>They all get background checks every year, even if returning from being there another time. The kids are kept off away from most of the camp's ground for most of the time and nobody is allowed in that area without being on the list of approved people who have been screened. While actually inside Como (for instance at the pool) there are so many counsellors around that there is no opportunity for anyone to be alone with any of the kids. One man had a camera... his film was taken and it turned out there were no pictures of the kids anyway. So you see, most of the time the kids are kept away from even the Como members. The camp isn't always held at Como BTW. Last year I think it was at Sunsport Gardens. FANR started them and now AANR is running with this concept and getting camps started in other parts of the country.

If Foley has his way all summer camps will require the parents to be present. Honestly this does destroy some of the reasons behind going to camp. It is supposed to let the kids develop on their own and to let them experience being on their own away from the parents and let the parents have a vacation away from the kids.

With all that goes on at camps anymore I can understand not trusting the camps with the welfare of your children. There was one camp that had the adults making bets on forced fist fighting between the kids just recently. It is a shame we can't trust these camps enough to let the kids be on their own for a few weeks.

R.M. Greenman...Dont let fear rule your life....Much publicity of certain crimes,blow their possibilities way out of proportion...Use common sense in protecting your family..Check out the camps ..and teach children how to protect themselves...and be happy living your life...We only get one time around and it passes too quickly /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif ...Outdoorbare

[greensunshine]

My Question to everyone is:

How are we to know someone is a pediphile until something actually occurs...and while someone may be listed as a sex offender in one state...does that mean they are registered as a sex offender in all states???

The other part of my question is:

What about those who do not commit their first offense until they are actually given an opportunity to commit???

And Finally, what good or harm does it do if either a background check is done or not done???

Saddly for an offender to be considered an offender all it requires is a first chance and who knows that may even be within his or her own family...sex offenders are also females, but then again so are rapists /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

Greensunshine in the Pacific NW /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
A surviving Child molestor/Rape victum/survivor

[R.M. Greenman]

Greensunshine, You are not alone!

[Bob S.]

Oh, so many topics.

First, I would hope that every children's camp would screen its counselors. Just like the interview is important, so is the background check.

And for Vin and David, I think the parents have the hardest time with camps, especially overnight camps. And yes, any parent should get to know all about the camp where they are considering sending their child. To no do so would be close to neglect. And any bad feeings that you get should factor into the decision.

RM, just realize that the odds are daughters will make it through their childhood without encountering any bad guys. Be vigilant, but don't think that there are pervs around every corner.

Bob S.

[Bob S.]

Stu,

You are right that children can grow up without having seen a naked adult and still come out healthy, but it requires much more than relaxing with the dress code. And there are many types of intelligence. Your eldest daughter seems to have great book intelligence, in other words, she learned what she needed to learn in school. I also assume that she has learned some great morality from her parents.

But there is her father's anxiety that she has also lived through. Anxiety over the human body. The same as both of your eldest children. They have learned that their father does not want to see them naked. How did you explain this to them? How about your wife? Does she mind seeing them naked? Have they ever seen her naked, at least accidentally?

You state that your son "Lives in hope" at seeing a naked female. Nudist children never have this want. They already have seen the naked adult bodies and find them commonplace. Your son (and daughter) apparently have a sexualized view of the body. Your son's comment is proof. He wants to see a naked female body because it is sexually appealing to him, especially at his age. This is how the whole world of adult magazines gets its money. People grow up not having seen a naked adult and they find this very thing being sold on the streets for not too much money. And since the focus on the nudity is sex, the view is perpetuated, with the exploitation of women and the ultra-thin waifs who are in those pics.

If you really want to see less of the (are they called Page 5 women?) adult entertainment, nude pics, red light districts, one thing to do is to support more naturist rights, support the naturist lifestyle, and not make nudity so secretive.

Bob S.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by greensunshine:
My Question to everyone is:

How are we to know someone is a pediphile until something actually occurs...and while someone may be listed as a sex offender in one state...does that mean they are registered as a sex offender in all states??? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>You usually don't know even once something happens. Many pedophiles go undetected for years and even decades.

The sex offender lists don't go interstate. They only list those in one state. Not only that but not all sex offenders are pedophiles (rapists for instance) and some states list nudists caught in illegal places as sex offenders (like Delaware). This means that list can not be a 100% indication of a pedophile. <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>

The other part of my question is:

What about those who do not commit their first offense until they are actually given an opportunity to commit??? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>How can they commit an offense if they don't have an opportunity? <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>


And Finally, what good or harm does it do if either a background check is done or not done??? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It can only give an indication that there might be a problem if he has never been caught before. There is no way to absolutely weed out all sex offenders. <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>

Saddly for an offender to be considered an offender all it requires is a first chance and who knows that may even be within his or her own family...sex offenders are also females, but then again so are rapists /infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>The likelyhood that an offender is a family member is very high but the chances of that person being female are small statistically.

[Bob S.]

I agree with cyndiann's statements in reply to greenie's message, but still want to comment on a couple of her statements.

"How are we to know someone is a pediphile until something actually occurs."

You can't. I'm sure most serial murder victims are also like that, they don't know that the person has already killed someone else until it is too late. And most pedophiles are very nice. They have to be in order to gain the trust of the child. There is always the talk of "Stranger danger" but when kids are asked to describe a stranger who would hurt them, the picture is always of some dirty, unshaven, evil-looking man. They would never think of describing that nice man at the park who loves taking pictures.

You, the parent, must rely on how others behave. If there is a man who spends too much time with children that are not his during his leisure time, especially if he does not have any children of his own around him, that is a serious red flag.

"What about those who do not commit their first offense until they are actually given an opportunity to commit???"

Yes, before the first time, no crime has been committed. But again, you can usually tell who is likely going to committ a crime by looking at behaviours. And most of the abusers have committed many offenses before they are caught.

"And Finally, what good or harm does it do if either a background check is done or not done???"

A background check is only as good as the information that it provides. If someone has already molested children and has not been caught, then their check will come up clean. I'm sure it has stopped some people from working with children. And that is a good thing. A background check is not perfect, but it is better than just trusting a stranger on their word, especially when it comes to working with children.

Bob S.

[AussieBeachBoy]

Background checks are all very well, and I would support background checks for potential 'deviant' activity amongst any people working with children, but an important question is just what activities in a person's past or present life should render them unfit for such service. Here in Australia the Scouts have weeded out a number of gay scout leaders recently, in the absence of any indication or suggestion of impropriety, and a lot of good people have been lost to the movement. They permit female scout leaders in male troops - why not gay men?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>i have no doubt that MOST kids raised nudist would be better off than non-nudists. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I'd have to respectfully disagree with David here, mainly because there are so many other factors that go into making a child 'well off', including the love they receive from their family, quality of education and so forth. My view is that children raised in a naturist environment may have a more relaxed attitude towards the human body, but there is little more you can say about them as an overall group.