YMCA Summer Camps

[Kim Richards]

I was going to put this on my site on Yahoo, but all I seem to be getting are trolls at the moment, so I don't know if I'll develop it further.

Could you give me your opinions on whether YMCA Summer Camps should be required to allow nude camping for kids? I'm not talking about suits optional, I mean separate weeks. If you aren't comfortable posting, you can e-mail me private. Thanks. Kim.

[Kim Richards]

I was going to put this on my site on Yahoo, but all I seem to be getting are trolls at the moment, so I don't know if I'll develop it further.

Could you give me your opinions on whether YMCA Summer Camps should be required to allow nude camping for kids? I'm not talking about suits optional, I mean separate weeks. If you aren't comfortable posting, you can e-mail me private. Thanks. Kim.

[aunaturelone]

Of course they should offer it if there is enough demand. There isn't a snowball's chance in hell they would.

As to making it required, they are a private organization and can do as they please.

I doubt if your site (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/TENTS/) will fly. Yahoo will put it in the "adults only" catagory as soon as they twig to what it's about.

[Bob S.]

No they should not be required to offer nude camping just as Virginia should not require that no one can offer nude summer camps.

Choice is a big thing for private organizations. They should be free to run their businesses in any way they need to within reason.

Now aunaturelone said it right. If there is enough of a market, then yes, they should.

And aunaturelone, I have two yahoo groups that I moderate and own dealing with nudism that are not in the Adult section. Of course, they are discussion groups and I do not allow for pics.

Bob S.

[b777]

"As to making it required, they are a private organization and can do as they please"

A very true statement. For those that are old enough to remember, in the late '50's and early '60's, the policy at our YMCA was that nudity was required when swimming (didn't want to clog up the pool's filtering system!) That changed in the mid '60's. Could they reverse the policy again? Sure they could, but in today's society, that is not very likely.

[Trailscout]

I don't think anyone believes that yarn about clogging up the filters at the bottom of the pool.

Diving down to unclog the drain would give the pool guy something useful to do.

The real reason that clothing was prohibited was that nudity was an antidote to effeminate shyness, and perhaps secondly it was viewed as a Spartan thing to do, sort of hardening yourself against the elements by being nude.

[Naturist Mark]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
I don't think anyone believes that yarn about clogging up the filters at the bottom of the pool.
Diving down to unclog the drain would give the pool guy something useful to do. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>The filters are not at the bottom of the pool. And I DO believe that wearing clothing in pools makes them much filthier than nude swimming does. I've cleaned pools. I've seen the filth. One 45 pound little girl in her shorts and t-shirt can change the color of the water. Believe!

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
The real reason that clothing was prohibited was that nudity was an antidote to effeminate shyness, and perhaps secondly it was viewed as a Spartan thing to do, sort of hardening yourself against the elements by being nude. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Now that is also entirely believable.

-Mark

[b777]

I was not saying I bought in to that line, only that it was often quoted as the reason, and being 7 -9 years old at the time, I was not going to challenge it.

One reason that it will never likely go back is the current attitudes toward nudity. A recent post on the member's bulletin board had a woman complaining about mothers bringing in their opposite sex children in to the locker room (the official age limit for this is 5 and under is OK, > 5 must use the appropriate locker room). This wasn't a complaint that the child was too old, just tha fact that the young child was looking around!(big surprise, kids are curious).

Since the only way to the pool is through the locker room, this is not easy to get around. I would not let a young child go through by themselves and my daughters saw many a locker room / men's restrooms when they were small, with nary a complaint, and had there been any, the complainer would have gotten an earful from me.

[Donbon]

Here's some friendly advice: Don't waste your time because it is not going to happen. If you have been keeping up with communications on why the Y's and high schools have abolished the nude swimming, etc. for boys and men, then you can understand why I give you this advice.

[Rex]

In regard to keeping the pool clean.
Years ago, I had a friend who was a great party giver.
Ray had a notice by his backyard pool: "Dress For The Pool, Clean Bathers Or Clean Skin".
Ray didn't care if his party guests wore swimwear or were nude, just as long as they were clean. And all his guests knew it.
No general clothing, no underwear, no sweaty swimwear, and no unshowered bodies.
When we bought this house, with it's large heated, salt water pool, and private backyard, it was the first time we'd had our own pool.
I got a pool guy to come around and give me some advice. I told him we were very particular about personal hygiene, and told him about my friend's attitude. He said we were absolutely correct, and if we stuck to that policy, we could safely keep the chlorine level at the lower end of the "safe" limit, so no chloriney smell, in the air, or on skin or hair.
I know it's not as easy with a public pool, and that's one reason I don't want to use them.

[luvnaturism]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Trailscout:
I don't think anyone believes that yarn about clogging up the filters at the bottom of the pool.

Diving down to unclog the drain would give the pool guy something useful to do.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It wouldn't be an issue today, but the fabrics that are used in swimming suits now didn't exist when I was a kid swimming in a pool that didn't permit boys to wear anything. Mostly suits were made of cotton, but there were some wool suits still in use.

My understanding of the technology is that pool filters (always installed in a separate room) were more difficult and relatively expensive to clean. After having owned a home pool for 25 years, I can tell you that even today finding ways to minimize the chore of cleaning the filters is desirable (though lint is no longer an issue as long as swimmers aren't wearing cutoffs).

I'm another who swam nude many times at the YMCA. If there was rule against suits, I never knew it. It just didn't make any sense to be dressed for swimming when it was only men and boys, and no one ever did. I was past 30 before I ever wore a suit at a Y.

As others have said, those days are gone forever.

[Trailscout]

I came along too late for nude swims at the YMCA. During summer day camp for elementary schoolaged boys, we kids, along with the teenaged counselor, undressed in a clearing in the woods, put on our swim trunks and walked to the lake for our swimming lessons. At this campground, there was a dining hall, but there was no bathhouse, so we changed outdoors. No one worried about the brief nudity. We were much more concerned about the terrible lightning from thunderstorms that seemed to plague our lake and those annoying tiny red biting bugs called chiggers that infested the woods.

[gimpy64]

If i'm not mistaken, the YMCA changed its policy of permitting men and boys to swim nude when it went co-ed. This is not in anyway to blame women, just an historical fact. What I would like to see happend is that the YMCA institute clothing-optional hours at its pool facilites, for instance, from 8 to 10 pm on weekends. This way everyone can enjoy the care-free feeling of nude swimming. But as other have said, this is not likely to happen.

Paece and stay naked.
Greg M.

[Trailscout]

Gimpy,

Are you talking about coed family nude swims or just the guys, then the gals at a later hour?

What is the possibility of an individual YMCA instituting nude swims? Would it have to be a world-wide change in policy?

[luvnaturism]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Trailscout:
. . . . those annoying tiny red biting bugs called chiggers that infested the woods. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Chiggers are one of my really bad memories from childhood. I suppose individuals react differently, but chiggers drive me crazy with itching while mosquitos have little effect.

Chiggers are actually tiny spiders. For those who haven't encountered these little devils, they're about the size of the point of a pin. The aggravation they cause is way out of proportion to their size, particularly since they are fond of getting into the places where your clothes chafe against your body?such as under the waistband of your pants.

[aunaturelone]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> the YMCA changed its policy of permitting men and boys to swim nude when it went coed <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Bingo! Exactly right.

[stevenf64]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Trailscout:
I don't think anyone believes that yarn about clogging up the filters at the bottom of the pool.

Diving down to unclog the drain would give the pool guy something useful to do.

The real reason that clothing was prohibited was that nudity was an antidote to effeminate shyness, and perhaps secondly it was viewed as a Spartan thing to do, sort of hardening yourself against the elements by being nude. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>First, the particles that damage the LINING in the filter tanks are mostly to small to see, otherwise the strainers would take them out. Second most filters in Y's are very old to begin with. If you dont think that this is true than maybe you would pay the 12,000 dollar bill out Y had to pay to get our filters relined.
As for the Pool guy, most of them are lifeguards and even if they were not need to save people you would not have swimming at the Y if no lifeguards, Its an insurance thing.

AND FINALLY the real reason that nude swimming was removed was that to survive as a health facility it had to become a co-ed facility (to attract families) and they figured women and little girls wouldnt join if nude was alive. TO nudists nude is not rude but let me say I have seen (and had to deal with) very rude people who dont know how to act.

[Trailscout]

Well Steven, this has been a real education for me. I have heard that story about filters for a long time, but I never gave it much creedence until your explanation. I guess body hair and head hair is too big to clog the filter. Is that correct? Are synthetic swimsuit fabrics such as polyester clogging filters or does this refer to cotton only?

I wish the Y had not banned nude swimming altogether after they went coed, but had retained a couple of hours of family nude swim time, say once a week. Then those who object could swim anytime but those two hours.

[David77]

<center><font size= "3">A Good Recent Policy of the Ys</font size></center>

Two beautiful new Ys have been built near where I live. They each have THREE types of dressing rooms (locker rooms) and they are designated, "Men", "Women" and <u>"Families"</u>.

The Y recognizes that it is not immoral for families to become nude while changing together. However, I suppose that this policy was implemented mainly so that parents could better care for their children.

Parents with children of the opposite gender over age 3 are expected to use the family changing rooms with their young child, but any family can use the seperate family changing rooms. Even an unrelated male and female can use the family changing rooms if one has some incapacity and needs the help in changing.

[Rex]

Hi Steven,
Thanks for the info on filters.
As I have posted elsewhere on this thread, I'm very particular about personal, and pool hygeine.
We bought the house 3 years ago in June, but the pool was already several years old, and I don't know what previous owners may have done in that respect.
I had the water checked, when we first moved in, and it was safe for swimming, and I've kept it safe.
In all that time, one person has worn a swimsuit once only.
I may replace the filter before next [Australian] summer. It will be a fairly large capacity sand type domestic model.
I've always thought of not wearing bathers as a personal choice thing, but I would love to know if it is beneficial to the effectiveness and life of the filter.

[MikeJB]

I think the Y seems to have too many conservative religious people running it because youd think if they had more liberal people running it theyd be more open about allowing more nudity there. I guess it has to do with the conservative aspect and I guess theyre just trying to cover their asses. I just think we need to go back to the notion that nudity isnt bad and its a great thing for times like being in the pool and going to the beach and stuff like that. I think that if we didnt allow alot of these conservative wackos into the congress and presidental areas then maybe our nudist situation would be a little different these days.

[Kari P]

A foreigner asks just for curiosity:

You Americans seem to use the letters YMCA or just Y as a synonym of a public swimming-pool or swimming-hall. Right? And why?

I believe to know that the letters stand for Young Men's Christian Association. I can understand that such associations operate public pools, but are they the only operators?

In my country public swimming-halls are usually operated by municipalities. I think there is a demand of family changing rooms or mixed-sex family days in the usually segragated rooms (then non-segragated saunas and nude swimming could be allowed, naturally), but this demand is poorly satisfied. But I don't know here any official age limit for taking a child to the "wrong" side. I've taken my then seven-year-old daughter to the men's side, no one complained, staff included.

Kari P

[Naturist Mark]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kari P:
You Americans seem to use the letters YMCA or just Y as a synonym of a public swimming-pool or swimming-hall. Right? And why? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>YMCA does stand for Young Men's Christian Association, but it has long since evolved into a a family oriented recreation association. Since the YMCA changed it has commonly been called the "Y", but really only the "A" still applies.

"Y's" are not government organizations, they are private non-profit membership organizations. The pools they operate are for members and their guests, but while they may be open to the general public at certain times, they are not 'public swimming pools'.

At one time the YMCA was exclusively a male organization (there were also YWCA's for females). Since the nudity taboo in America used to only apply in mixed sex situations, nude swimming was common (or mandatory) at all male YMCA pools.

-Mark

[luvnaturism]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Kari P:
I can understand that such associations operate public pools, but are they the only operators?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No, there are many other pool operators, both public and private. Where I live there are several swimming pools owned by the county, and many pools available by membership. The health club that I belong has two pools plus a hot spa. It also has a dry sauna and a steam room.

The pools are outdoors, and are used by both sexes and all ages. There is a sauna and steam bath in each adult locker room, so what you do or don't wear is up to you.

[Bob S.]

Kari, as Mark and luv have mentioned, the YMCA is just one of many private businesses/governments that operate pools. When we refer to the YMCA, we are talking specifically about the YMCA and not any other operator of pools.

Bob S.

[Trailscout]

I suppose that in the days of cotton bathing suits, women at the YWCA, with their much larger bathing suits clogged up their pool filters much more rapidly than men.

That is, assuming that women were not required to swim nude when the YWCA was for women only.

[fred950]

During the late 'fifties, my sister and I both went to a YMCA summer day-camp. Generally speaking, after spending a good part of the day at a local forest perserve, we would go back to the Y building for a swim just before time to go home. Always co-ed, always swim suits required. After day-camp hours for the pool, it was male only, nudity required. The explanation was the filtering equipment. Then how come that didn't apply to the day-camp swim? /infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif

[hm0504]

Regarding pool cleanliness and nudity, one trend (and I think it is a trend) is that people seem to be showering swimsuit-clad, if at all, at the pool.

Curious, how many arrive with their swimsuits already on.

Now if I note someone has not showered before going into the pool, I try to think maybe he showered at home (if so, probably earlier in the day).

Then, there are those who shower wearing a swimsuit. Now, recollecting my understanding of how the human anatomy functions, bodily waste (which contains much of the dangerous stuff) exits from portals covered, and thus made inaccessible to cleaning, by said swimsuit. I'd sure like to see the pool people and society in general enforce proper showering. At least at naturist swims, people seem to wash themselves thoroughly before, and after, being in the pool. (Though I guess one cannot do much about those who were there earlier, just hope the chlorine has done its job.)

[Trailscout]

Fred,

Anyone with common sense could see that it doesn't do much good to require the men to be nude yet allow the women to wear bathing suits. The ladies' typically wore more square inches of fabric than the men did! So unless everyone is nude, the filters would still have clogged.

HM, Pool managers at every pool should require nude showers immediately before people swim. There should be no exceptions to this. If it were official policy, it would give "permission" to those who were a bit on the shy side.

[Rex]

So it seems as if nudists are not only more likely to have "clean" minds, they're also more likely to have clean bodies as well.
This should be seen as very important in public areas.
Perhaps something could be made of this, like complaints being made to the owners of the facility, followed by complaints to the media, if appropriate health measures are not put in place.

[MikeJB]

Ive always wondered how many people go to the pool in just their swimsuits instead of wearing regular clothing to the pool and then changing into the swimsuit. is it even legal to walk around outside in a just a swimsuit? Most people ive seen come in their clothes and change into the swimsuit when they get there or just have swimsuit on but wear other stuff too. Too bad public nudity isnt legal and too bad the pools dont let you swim nude there, otherwise u could just come nude, get a quick shower and jump in the drink.