How much does it cost for your nonlanded clubs events and memberships??

[George F.]

Hello everyone,

I would like to ask that only people who belong to nonlanded clubs post a response to the questions in this thread. (Others are free to make comments just don't post answers to the questions unless you belong to a non landed club like I am asking about!!) I am trying to determine whether our organization/club's cost structure for memberships and our swim nights is reasonable, excessive, or way below normal. I am asking this because several of our members are of the belief that our costs for membership is unreasonable as is our swim night fees.

Here goes the questions:

How long does your organization swim last?

How much does it cost for a single person that is a member of your organization to get into your organzations swim night?

How much does it cost for a couple that is a member of your organization to get into your organization's swim night?

How much does it cost for a non member single to attend your organization's swim night?

How much does it cost for a non member couple to attend your organizations swim night?

How much does it cost for a year's membership in your organization and is that price per person or per couple and does it include membersip in TNS or AANRT?

Here is what our organization's cost structure looks like for swims and for membership in our organization/club:

A 1 year membership cost $48.00, this amount is the same regardless of whether you join as a single or if you join as a couple. This is for membership only and does not include AANR or TNS membership.

The costs to attend one of our monthly swims which is held for two hours are as follows:

Nonmember single: $8.00 Nonmember Couple:$12.00

Member single: $5.00 Member couple: $8.00

I am of the belief that our organization's cost structure is probably one of the lowest in the midwest if not the entire United States when it comes to a non landed organization, I am also of the same belief when it comes to how much it costs to attend our swims each month.

I would be greatly appreacitive of any answers that I can get in this thread as I am trying to be fair to our membership in terms of cost and if we are indeed high on our costs then I would be willing to have our board members discuss the issue and possibly make changes.

Thanks in advance,

George

[George F.]

Hello everyone,

I would like to ask that only people who belong to nonlanded clubs post a response to the questions in this thread. (Others are free to make comments just don't post answers to the questions unless you belong to a non landed club like I am asking about!!) I am trying to determine whether our organization/club's cost structure for memberships and our swim nights is reasonable, excessive, or way below normal. I am asking this because several of our members are of the belief that our costs for membership is unreasonable as is our swim night fees.

Here goes the questions:

How long does your organization swim last?

How much does it cost for a single person that is a member of your organization to get into your organzations swim night?

How much does it cost for a couple that is a member of your organization to get into your organization's swim night?

How much does it cost for a non member single to attend your organization's swim night?

How much does it cost for a non member couple to attend your organizations swim night?

How much does it cost for a year's membership in your organization and is that price per person or per couple and does it include membersip in TNS or AANRT?

Here is what our organization's cost structure looks like for swims and for membership in our organization/club:

A 1 year membership cost $48.00, this amount is the same regardless of whether you join as a single or if you join as a couple. This is for membership only and does not include AANR or TNS membership.

The costs to attend one of our monthly swims which is held for two hours are as follows:

Nonmember single: $8.00 Nonmember Couple:$12.00

Member single: $5.00 Member couple: $8.00

I am of the belief that our organization's cost structure is probably one of the lowest in the midwest if not the entire United States when it comes to a non landed organization, I am also of the same belief when it comes to how much it costs to attend our swims each month.

I would be greatly appreacitive of any answers that I can get in this thread as I am trying to be fair to our membership in terms of cost and if we are indeed high on our costs then I would be willing to have our board members discuss the issue and possibly make changes.

Thanks in advance,

George

[WNYjoe17]

You do it quite differently than our club did before I relocated. But it seems like you do it in a way that evens it out.

We had the problem of a lot of our fees being non-stuctured and informal for a long time. The opinion when it became more organized was too significant a change would be received poorly.

Our membership fees were a whopping $15 per year. Per person OR couple. Actually, after a minor structuring, it might have been $20 per couple. I forget now.
Swims that did not cost the club any significant amount of funds were $5 per person. We also rented the nearby facilities of a local club. Fees were $15 per person, $25 per couple. It meant we nneded to get attendance of 40 members to break even with the fees charged by the facility.
Membership or membership in another club, or AANR/TNS each provided a reduction of about 10%-20%. With numbers rounded based on the actual price. (It is a heck of a lot easier to charge either $20 or $25 than it is $22)

The idea was typically that if you were a one-timer, it was not worth it. But if you attended several events, membership (and it's activity fee reduction) would pay for itself after a few events.

BUT, you also need to look at the local economy. How much can your members afford? What are you offering? What are your fees? What added benefits are included? (food, snacks, copies of Naturist magazines...etc)
I would also suggest you look at he fees of laned clubs. Granted, some are very luxurious, and some are more rustic. But you wil be able to take the trends you learn here even farther.

When all else fails, you can justify it all you want. But if people are opting to stay away because of your fees, then they need to be restructured. There is an old saying "perception is reality."

(hmmmm...As I sit here typing listening to Tony Snow speak about Iraq, the same thing comes to mind abut our fiasco over there..."Perception IS reality."

Joe

[CollarFreeWorker]

Our travel club has annual dues of $40 per couple or per single male; single females half-price. New members joining pay $50 their first year for a couple or single male, $25 for a single female.

In addition, we ask our members to contribute $5/couple or $3/single to our host couples at home parties and pool parties to help cover their hosting expenses, and of course everyone is expected to bring a pot-luck dish to contribute to the dinner as well as their own beverages in a cooler.

Last year, we had more than 35 club events and parties. We're on track to exceed that figure this year. That's more than a month of clothes-free fun for our members, for less than the cost of one day's grounds fees at a local landed resort.

We don't have any complaints about our dues structure or other fees.

Later,

Mike

[Cheri]

BTW, we are trying to get away from using the term "travel club" as a number of nonlanded clubs are getting asked to help with travel arrangements. Since I get soooo many emails (over 300) daily to which I need to answer about a third plus the number of emails to my regular job are small either.

Travelites cannot find a health club or any pool available to rent during cooler months. We did find a bowling alley at one time, but we couldn't garner enough interest among the members.

Our annual dues: $60/year plus AANR and/or TNS membership.

There is an event fee of $2/person for each event.

We do schedule special events such as our Oyster Roasts that additional costs are necessary for the food and our annual canude trip. The club does provide the entree for special occasions such as the turkey for Thanksgiving and the corned beef for St. Patrick's Day.
Cheri

[Rabid_Clam]

Are there any such clubs in the Richmond, Va area ???

[Cheri]

There used to be a nonlanded club in that area, but it appears no longer to be in existence.
Cheri

[kphoger]

i'm starting a nudist group in my area (see my tag line), but it's not a typical nonlanded club. i'm just aiming to create a network of nudists in the area and allow them to develop friendships. pretty soon i'll probably be organizing the first get-to-know-you mixer at a restaurant or something.

anyway, because it's not a typical club, i don't have to worry about membership fees, or any of that official jazz. for a dinner party at someone's house, i wouldn't charge any money, unless the host needed people to chip in for food or something. for a trip to a nearby resort, the cost of admission and food would be fine.

why pay for stuff you don't need to pay for? so far, the group works via email and a Yahoo group - both of which are free.

maybe i'm just cheap. (:

[Cheri]

kphoger, Without having a formal group under the umbrella of one or both of the national organizations might be a problem down the road. I've seen it. Should there be a car wreck after/during the event, the courts can summon and ask about all who were there. If there is a problem at one of the gatherings and the authorities are brought in, who's going to support the group of friends.

Wouldn't it be better to be under than blanket of security, under AANR and/or TNS?

What happens if a youngster accompanies a non-custodial parent to an event and the custodial parent throws a fit? Who's going to support that noncustodial parent? It's happened to people with whom I'm acquainted. The noncustodial parent lost all visitation for 2 years and now can only visit with supervision.

Cheri

[usuallylurk]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by George F.:
Hello everyone,

I would like to ask that only people who belong to nonlanded clubs post a response to the questions in this thread. (Others are free to make comments just don't post answers to the questions unless you belong to a non landed club like I am asking about!!) I am trying to determine whether our organization/club's cost structure for memberships and our swim nights is reasonable, excessive, or way below normal. I am asking this because several of our members are of the belief that our costs for membership is unreasonable as is our swim night fees.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

How long does your organization swim last?

Four hours. 1 pm to 5 pm for one of the groups. 12 to 4 for the other.


How much does it cost for a single person that is a member of your organization to get into your organzations swim night?

One charges $15. The other (couples) is $10 per person.

How much does it cost for a couple that is a member of your organization to get into your organization's swim night?

One charges $25. The other $20.

How much does it cost for a non member single to attend your organization's swim night?

I think $20 for one. The other is NA (not applicable) -- because of its couples' orientation, the only way a single would get in is as a guest of a member.

How much does it cost for a non member couple to attend your organizations swim night?

$30 (I think) and $30 for the other.

How much does it cost for a year's membership in your organization and is that price per person or per couple and does it include membersip in TNS or AANRT?

OK, one of the clubs, I don't know. The membership is $20 per couple regardless of national association membership. The first club is both TNS and AANR affiliated. You can get TNS through the group at a slight discount.

The other is AANR-only, and if you join as a couple it's $15 w/o AANR, $75 with it.

Neither group is 100 percent AANR.


Here is what our organization's cost structure looks like for swims and for membership in our organization/club:

A 1 year membership cost $48.00, this amount is the same regardless of whether you join as a single or if you join as a couple. This is for membership only and does not include AANR or TNS membership.


That's a little unfair IMHO. And why do you need $48???? That's a lot of money, unless you're using the dues to subsidize the events.


The costs to attend one of our monthly swims which is held for two hours are as follows:

Nonmember single: $8.00 Nonmember Couple:$12.00

Member single: $5.00 Member couple: $8.00

I am of the belief that our organization's cost structure is probably one of the lowest in the midwest if not the entire United States when it comes to a non landed organization, I am also of the same belief when it comes to how much it costs to attend our swims each month.


You're probably right. What it's all dependent on is the cost of renting the facility. Other operational costs for a non-landed club are largely a trivial matter.

Or -- it SHOULD be trivial.



I would be greatly appreacitive of any answers that I can get in this thread as I am trying to be fair to our membership in terms of cost and if we are indeed high on our costs then I would be willing to have our board members discuss the issue and possibly make changes.



You're not high on the cost of the events. But I do ask, why do you collect the $48????

That seems awfully high and unnecessary, unless there's something that I'm missing here.

[usuallylurk]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Rabid_Clam:
Are there any such clubs in the Richmond, Va area ??? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

As we advised in an earlier thread a long time ago, there apparently are none registered with AANR and TNS.

If there are any, they keep to themselves, may also conduct themselves as a closed circle of friends, and the only way you get in is if someone invites you in.

And the only way they'll invite you in is if they get to know you.

Now, this sounds self-defeating. "How do I get into this group if they won't tell me where they are, or how to join up?"

Easy -- go to the events that you CAN get to. If you're in Richmond, you're only 80 miles from the groups in northern Virginia. AANR lists four of them.

And White Tail Park -- in Ivor, is only around 65 miles from Richmond.

If there are private, unlisted groups in your area, as we discussed some months back, and they have no listings, and they have no web presence, and choose not to affiliate with either of the two major national groups -- then -- my advice is to go to the other groups' events and maybe, just maybe you'll be lucky to stumble into one of their members.

And if you're luckier, they may extend an invite.

With White Tail only 65 miles from Richmond, there is no question that there are members from your area that are members there.

I'm sure that people from Central Virginia go up to the non-landed groups in the DC area as well.

But if a group keeps to itself and doesn't advertise its presence, they certainly aren't going to invite people to house parties and gatherings from a bulletin board post. If a group exists but is "closed" - you won't get an invite unless a member knows you and also vouches for you.

I've been invited to private gatherings, and also have hosted them, but we've only been invited by people who got to know us.

Likewise, we don't invite anyone over until we've met them in other environments and gotten to know them first.

[Cheri]

Reasons for a nonlanded club's dues:
Who pays for the club's web presence. What about advertising? What about email or regular postage? Who buys the plastic ware and plates, etc. for events? What about paying for other incidentals such as turkey for Thanksgiving, Corned Beef for St. Patrick's event?

Cheri

[usuallylurk]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Cheri:
Reasons for a nonlanded club's dues:
Who pays for the club's web presence. What about advertising? What about email or regular postage? Who buys the plastic ware and plates, etc. for events? What about paying for other incidentals such as turkey for Thanksgiving, Corned Beef for St. Patrick's event?

Cheri </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Again, as I said, it depends on what the club provides at its events.

Most non-landeds run somewhat informally, and also set their events up to be self sustaining.

At their events, the only things usually provided are sundries (plastic ware, plates, etc.). Maine Coast now provides a pretty good food spread -- and people bring things to share, and soda and plasticware are provided. Still, the cost of that doesn't approach $48 per year per household.

There are mailings from both groups, no doubt about it -- but maybe one or two snail-mailings a year. That runs the cost to about $1 - $1.50 a household per year.

Advertising? Almost free. Every club has a web page, and a web page costs very little. An e-mail box costs NOTHING. There is advertising provided through the AANR and TNS links, and both clubs (Sherwood, Maine Coast Solar Bares) I referred to have contacts that are relatively easy to find.

E-mail announcements to members are also absolutely free.

Special events? While each club provides soda, etc., the luncheon table is basically a pot luck.

So -- if the $48 went to cover the cost of events, and it were going to, say, turkey for Thanksgiving or a roast Corned Beef spread at St Pat's day, I could understand it.

But, most non-landeds up here that host a swim for a night, only solicit food donations, or the club dues may pay for a deli platter once in awhile -- but the cost of the events are self-sustaining.

Most non-landed clubs up in this neck of the woods are run on a shoestring by design. Some groups don't even have a formal structure, preferring to "advertise" word-of-mouth, and extending specific invites to new members.

So it depends on what the club wants to be, and how it defines itself. One of the reasons some groups don't link up to TNS or AANR is that they would lose some of their informality -- and they would become far less insular than they'd like to be.

Some groups are very happy to have a low web presence and an e-mail address as a contact. Some don't want any "outside presence" at all. Others may wish to grow, and set themselves up as a small business.

Nothing's wrong with ANY of these approaches -- it's just that the non-landeds up here don't really think that they need high dues.

There are several advantages on being "low key". Size and growth can become an albatross.

The more members, the more likely internal politics are going to spring up.

It's a lot more difficult to enforce "peer group security" in a group of 100 than it is with a group of 25-40.

A large club can easily outgrow whatever facilities they're using -- be it a small rented pool, a bed and breakfast, a private house, etc.

And if they lose their facilities, it can lead to the rapid demise of a club.

Small and informal isn't necessarily all that bad. But as I said, it depends on what the club really wants to do or how its members wish to define themselves.

It's necessary for any organization to do three things --

1) Operate in black ink. This does not mean that a non-landed club operate with a profit motive but they must try to bring in more than they spend. But if that "more" is $1 a year, that's fine.

2) Attract enough members to sustain its existence. This does not necessarily mean going out and recruiting. BUT ... any group will have some attrition. People move away, or their health, finances or life situations don't permit continued participation, and, also, there are inevitabilities in this life for everyone. If a club begins losing members, it must do what its members feel is right in bringing in new members to replace them.

3) Keep their members happy. Bigger is not necessarily better. It's a recreational club. A non-landed club's purpose is to provide pleasure and recreation for its members, and if nothing else comes about from it, that's OK.

[Cheri]

Snail mail is more than the once in a blue moon to the members. Aren't there any inquiries that come by mail not giving you an email address with which to contact the prospective.
What about the postage transmitting AANR and/or TNS dues to their offices. That must be done via USPS.

Every three years, the main website costs $78. The prodigy website costs $20 and includes 10 email addresses along with 10 available websites. We don't have DSL here...yet.

AANR sends out a monthly prospect list. I send out packets to those in our geographic area at 63 cents per packet. There are also those in our area who do inquire via mail and deserve a written response.

When prospective members are met over a cup of coffee at a Denny's type restaurant, the club pays for those club members meeting the prospective individual(s). Generally, it's just a coke.

Perhaps Travelites, Inc. does more than some, but there are others that do even more.

Cheri

[comicsfan2001]

[quote]Here goes the questions:

>How long does your organization swim last?

3.5 hours

>How much does it cost for a single person that is a member of your organization to get into your organzations swim night?

$41.00 male/ $28.00 female ($5.00 discount for early registration)

>How much does it cost for a couple that is a member of your organization to get into your organization's swim night?

$41.00 (5.00 discount for early registration)

>How much does it cost for a non member single to attend your organization's swim night?

$60.00 male/$39.00 female($5.00 discount for early registration)

>How much does it cost for a non member couple to attend your organizations swim night?

$60.00 ($5.00 discount for early registration)

>How much does it cost for a year's membership in your organization and is that price per person or per couple and does it include membersip in TNS or AANRT?

Membership is $25.00 per adult. This does not include price of optional membership in TNS or ANNR.

Comicsfan

[usuallylurk]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Cheri:
Snail mail is more than the once in a blue moon to the members. Aren't there any inquiries that come by mail not giving you an email address with which to contact the prospective.
What about the postage transmitting AANR and/or TNS dues to their offices. That must be done via USPS.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

39c a month, max.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
Every three years, the main website costs $78. The prodigy website costs $20 and includes 10 email addresses along with 10 available websites. We don't have DSL here...yet.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think both Sherwood and MCSB pay considerably less that that for their websites.

Sherwood uses a Juno e-mail (free). MCSB uses a Yahoo e-mail (free).

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
AANR sends out a monthly prospect list. I send out packets to those in our geographic area at 63 cents per packet. There are also those in our area who do inquire via mail and deserve a written response.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know what they do, but I don't think either club does a lot of recruiting that way.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
When prospective members are met over a cup of coffee at a Denny's type restaurant, the club pays for those club members meeting the prospective individual(s). Generally, it's just a coke.

Perhaps Travelites, Inc. does more than some, but there are others that do even more.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Probably, and it's admirable. But most non-landeds probably just answer direct inquiries. Geography in northern New England makes meeting with every inquirer impractical.

A phone screen would be sufficient.

[usuallylurk]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by comicsfan2001:
[quote]Here goes the questions:


>How much does it cost for a single person that is a member of your organization to get into your organzations swim night?

$41.00 male/ $28.00 female ($5.00 discount for early registration)

>How much does it cost for a couple that is a member of your organization to get into your organization's swim night?

$41.00 (5.00 discount for early registration)

>How much does it cost for a non member single to attend your organization's swim night?

$60.00 male/$39.00 female($5.00 discount for early registration)

>How much does it cost for a non member couple to attend your organizations swim night?

$60.00 ($5.00 discount for early registration)

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Ouch.

And the clubs up here seem to have enough of a gender balance that they haven't found it necessary to charge men a lot more than women.

[Cheri]

usuallylurk, If someone lives more than 45 minutes away, then we do have a telephone screening. Meeting in person serves two uses.
We get to know a little bit more about someone and they get to meet someone before they attend an event. Also if it's a couple with a child/children, we can sense if the child is rowdy or civil.

It's worked for over 20 years.
Cheri

[Shangri La]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by George F.:

How long does your organization swim last?
Usually from about 11 to 7 with a pot luck dinner.

How much does it cost for a single person that is a member of your organization to get into your organzations swim night?
$5

How much does it cost for a couple that is a member of your organization to get into your organization's swim night?
$5

How much does it cost for a non member single to attend your organization's swim night?
I don't think they can except as a guest of a member and then $5

How much does it cost for a non member couple to attend your organizations swim night?
They would need to be a member somewhere else or a guest of a member and then $5

How much does it cost for a year's membership in your organization and is that price per person or per couple and does it include membersip in TNS or AANRT?
$45 for a single. $45 plus $30 for a couple or family. Does not include TNS or AANR dues.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

[usuallylurk]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Cheri:
usuallylurk, If someone lives more than 45 minutes away, then we do have a telephone screening. Meeting in person serves two uses.
We get to know a little bit more about someone and they get to meet someone before they attend an event. Also if it's a couple with a child/children, we can sense if the child is rowdy or civil.

It's worked for over 20 years.
Cheri </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's great -- it would be nice if every non-landed could do that. Of course, Travelites has a full scale of activities year-round. Up here, the non-landeds tend to not do a lot (but there are some activities) during the summer -- when they yield to landed club activities and outdoor nude recreation.

One club -- Naturist New Hampshire -- does have summer events.

[kphoger]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> So it depends on what the club wants to be, and how it defines itself. One of the reasons some groups don't link up to TNS or AANR is that they would lose some of their informality -- and they would become far less insular than they'd like to be. [etc.]
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>
wow, and i thought it was just me. i know people who have been to aanr/tns clubs and did not like the experience. they want a more intimate group of people, wherein they can be more picky about whom they fellowship with. one thing you don't get at a landed club or a typical aanr traveling club is insularity. from a business perspective, insularity isn't really a good thing, but i don't approach this from a business perspective. it's nice to know there are others out there who feel the same way.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Should there be a car wreck after/during the event, the courts can summon and ask about all who were there. If there is a problem at one of the gatherings and the authorities are brought in, who's going to support the group of friends.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>
is this not true in the rest of life? if a group of my friends decide to go shoot some pool, and there's a car wreck, people could be summoned to court. if i'm hosting a clothed dinner party at my house and the authorities have to be brought in, who's going to support the group of friends? if i explain to the officer that we're a nudist group and he doesn't seem to care, is he really going to be persuaded by an aanr card? maybe you're thinking about lawyers, but isn't that assuming i'm spearheading an official group, for which i would be legally responsible in court? basically, i'm nothing more than the moderator of a yahoo group.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> What happens if a youngster accompanies a non-custodial parent to an event and the custodial parent throws a fit? Who's going to support that noncustodial parent? It's happened to people with whom I'm acquainted. The noncustodial parent lost all visitation for 2 years and now can only visit with supervision.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>
this is dear to my heart. i am a noncustodial parent, the custodial parent is not a nudist, and her husband is a lawyer. now, all four of us parents get along great, but few alliances are stronger than that of mother-daughter. being in such a situation myself, i would definitely not allow a noncustodial parent (including myself) to bring a child to any nudist event without express permission from the custodial parent. was the noncustodial parent to whom you referred at an aanr/tns-affiliated club, or not?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Reasons for a nonlanded club's dues:
Who pays for the club's web presence. What about advertising? What about email or regular postage? Who buys the plastic ware and plates, etc. for events? What about paying for other incidentals such as turkey for Thanksgiving, Corned Beef for St. Patrick's event?
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>
web presence: a yahoo group, which is free.

advertising: my tag line on nudist web forums and a post on meetup.com, both of which are free.

email: i use my yahoo account, which is free.

postage: i email everything, so there is none.

food and table service: i don't charge any of my other visitors when they come over for a dinner party, so why should i charge nudists? if it's a lot of people, and we're all having pizza, people might be expected to chip in - but we all do that with our friends anyway.

======

aanr/tns does provide some benefits, of course. they have a strong network for referring people, they provide discounts, etc. but don't pretend that it's panacean. there are nudists who don't get along with and don't want to mix with the "typical" resort crowd. there are some nudists who don't want to take the chance that just any old nosy person might show up at an event and put their careers in jeopardy (if you don't believe that your lifestyle can put your career in jeopardy, then you haven't spent much time in a small town). there are some nudists like me who are cheap, and want to do everything possible for free. maybe some of them are homophobes, some are overly cautious, some are overly introverted, and some are cheapskates: use whatever label you want. but they are nudists and, for whatever reason, what's out there now doesn't do it for them.

not only do i not have to charge membership dues, but there's freedom of structure built in. in the beginning right now, i'm making the rules - and, by the way, i'm free to make them however i want without having to worry about whether aanr/tns agrees. but, once things get rolling, invitations will be left to the discretion of the host. some people might want to invite everyone on the yahoo group, no matter who they are. some might only want to invite their closest friends from the group. some might only want to invite people who have reluctant spouses. some might want to invite only christians, or only homosexuals, or only men, or only people who prefer the color green over the color blue. aanr/tns might have a problem with that, but people should be able to exclude and include whomever they want from their circle of friends.

of course, we've gotten off-topic. my original point was that there's no overhead, so there's no reason to charge any extra money.

[Cheri]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">is this not true in the rest of life? if a group of my friends decide to go shoot some pool, and there's a car wreck, people could be summoned to court. if i'm hosting a clothed dinner party at my house and the authorities have to be brought in, who's going to support the group of friends? if i explain to the officer that we're a nudist group and he doesn't seem to care, is he really going to be persuaded by an aanr card? maybe you're thinking about lawyers, but isn't that assuming i'm spearheading an official group, for which i would be legally responsible in court? basically, i'm nothing more than the moderator of a yahoo group. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes, but if it was aligned with the national orgs., you would have some substance to fight the relinguishing of records. Do you not know the people IN the Yahoo group, their names, etc.? You would be obligated to turn over that informtion to the authorities, the same as if you have an actual physical club that is not incorporated.

[QUOTE]
aanr/tns does provide some benefits, of course. they have a strong network for referring people, they provide discounts, etc. but don't pretend that it's panacean. there are nudists who don't get along with and don't want to mix with the "typical" resort crowd. there are some nudists who don't want to take the chance that just any old nosy person might show up at an event and put their careers in jeopardy (if you don't believe that your lifestyle can put your career in jeopardy, then you haven't spent much time in a small town). there are some nudists like me who are cheap, and want to do everything possible for free. maybe some of them are homophobes, some are overly cautious, some are overly introverted, and some are cheapskates: use whatever label you want. but they are nudists and, for whatever reason, what's out there now doesn't do it for them.

[\QUOTE]

Being affiliated with the nationals is not a pancea (I think that's the word you meant rather than pancean), but it's the best way to get out the word about your club. You get listed with each publication and in AANR's Bulletin you can brag on what your club does each month. You also get free club brochures to distribute as well as coOp advertisement rebates.

Cheri

[usuallylurk]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Cheri:
Yes, but if it was aligned with the national orgs., you would have some substance to fight the relinguishing of records. Do you not know the people IN the Yahoo group, their names, etc.? You would be obligated to turn over that informtion to the authorities, the same as if you have an actual physical club that is not incorporated.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Probably, not, if a legal action had nothing to do with nudism. Someone drives away from a nudist gathering , be it at someone's house, or a rented site, and something happens -(car wreck, DUI, etc.) - the police are going to ask questions, and people are going to have to answer. AANR will not be able to obstruct that process.

Some other thing? e.g., let's say someone is picked up for a sex crime.... and it's learned that he's a member of Podunk Valley Nudist Group (or an offense like that happens at or near a nudist site), then it might be a matter of concern for AANR or the NAC.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
Being affiliated with the nationals is not a pancea (I think that's the word you meant rather than pancean), but it's the best way to get out the word about your club. You get listed with each publication and in AANR's Bulletin you can brag on what your club does each month. You also get free club brochures to distribute as well as coOp advertisement rebates.

Cheri </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Panacean = related to a panacea.

But some groups -- by their members' wishes, may not want to advertise.

See my posting to rabid_clam on the subject. There are probably informal groups in the Richmond area, but they choose to use different means to control membership entry.

There is one other group that I know of that operates that way --- no advertising, no affiliations, no publicity -- and entry into the group is through the invitation of another member.

In fact, some could argue that the IN-formality and NON-organization by a group affords better legal protection than a chartered group.

Those who don't get along with others usually won't get invited in.

[luvtobenude]

How long does your organization swim last? - it last three hours

How much does it cost for a single person that is a member of your organization to get into your organzations swim night? - only $10.00

How much does it cost for a couple that is a member of your organization to get into your organization's swim night? - only $15.00

How much does it cost for a non member single to attend your organization's swim night? - $20.00 but they can only attend two events and then have to join to attend more

How much does it cost for a non member couple to attend your organizations swim night? - sam as above

How much does it cost for a year's membership in your organization and is that price per person or per couple and does it include membersip in TNS or AANRT? - per person is $20.00, per couple is $40.00 and it does not include membership in TNS or AANR

[Rick_42]

I've recently joined a non-landed club that's about 60 miles away so I'm not familiar with everything they do for their members or what they provide for events. They don't seem to be very active. (I've been waiting for my membership card since July.) I haven't attended a swim yet. But they're the only non-landed club I've been able to find in my part of the world. Here's what I know:

How long does your organization swim last?
They have monthly indoor swims from October to May and the swims last about 2 hours.

How much does it cost for a single person that is a member of your organization to get into your organization's swim night?
There is a $5 entry fee for each member.
How much does it cost for a couple that is a member of your organization to get into your organization's swim night?
I couldn't say for sure but I'm guessing it would be $5 each or $10 for a couple.
How much does it cost for a non member single to attend your organization's swim night?
$10
How much does it cost for a non member couple to attend your organizations swim night?
$20 ($10 each)
How much does it cost for a year's membership in your organization and is that price per person or per couple and does it include membersip in TNS or AANRT?
According to the club's web site, annual membership is $20 per year for singles, couples, and families. That does not include TNS/AANR membership. The club is affliliated with TNS.

During the summer (Memorial Day thru Labor Day) the club has monthly visits to nearby resorts. They generally have a potluck lunch or dinner with the club providing the meat dish. I've only attended a couple of the summer visits and the turnout of club members was rather low. I've been told they have other events such as get togethers, volleyball, and bowling but I don't know.