The Swan

[namedun]

Has anyone seen reality tv's newest tradgedy? For those of you who haven't, The Swan is a show where "ugly" women are taken in by the producers and have a complete make-over (including cosmetic surgery, athletic training, make-up, hair, etc.); Once the make-overs are done, two candidates are compared and "the most improved" candidate is selected to move on to a beauty pagent.
While it's nice that these women feel better about themselves after their transformations, I find the whole idea sickening. Sure, they're making a few women feel better (or maybe worse because of the beauty-pagent selection rounds), but imagine what this is doing to all women watching the show. It's simply proliferating the extreme pyschologicaly perceived importance of good looks that has been around since the birth of American pop-culture. I mean these women are left crying with joy all because they look different.

Thoughts?

Namedun /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

[namedun]

Has anyone seen reality tv's newest tradgedy? For those of you who haven't, The Swan is a show where "ugly" women are taken in by the producers and have a complete make-over (including cosmetic surgery, athletic training, make-up, hair, etc.); Once the make-overs are done, two candidates are compared and "the most improved" candidate is selected to move on to a beauty pagent.
While it's nice that these women feel better about themselves after their transformations, I find the whole idea sickening. Sure, they're making a few women feel better (or maybe worse because of the beauty-pagent selection rounds), but imagine what this is doing to all women watching the show. It's simply proliferating the extreme pyschologicaly perceived importance of good looks that has been around since the birth of American pop-culture. I mean these women are left crying with joy all because they look different.

Thoughts?

Namedun /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

[NudeAl]

A long, long time ago on the Twilight Zone there was and episode in which a young woman was to under go plastic surgery. Supposedly for her hideous looks. Well the bandages come off and she looked great, to most of us, and then they show her in a hand mirror and she freaks out and starts to scream. Then they pan back and show the Dr. and nurses etc. and they are grossly disfigured, by our standards. Then old Rod comes out and gives his speil about how beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Very true.

What I'm waiting for is the reality show where they take this great looking woman and then proceed to mess her up. Think that one will fly?

[REDCHIK]

I would definetly watch your version NudeAl, the only problem being, getting women to volenteer to go on the show. Add a cash prize of million or two, you'll probably find some takers/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[florida-david]

namedun- you are completely accurate. it is the continuation of the age old tradition of putting women in there place by making them think they all have to look a certain way. fortunately some women can fight this obsession, but most can not and find at least 100 things they would like to correct about the way they look. its a sad sad thing. i just a tv show last night about the problems with plastic surgery and how lots of women are having their various implants removed (the lady from baywatch comes to mind). they stressed that part of the reason was how uncomfortable these out of proportion breasts were and the problems with the saline leaking and causing them to get sick. they also showed cosmetic surgery gone wrong (michael jackson, loni anderson, and joan rivers to name a few). if they were nudists i think they would be more accepting of their little imperfections and could grow old gracefully instead of as a freaky plastic doll (one woman actually made herself to look like barbie, the arch enemy of all women!!!)

[Sugar High Armadillo]

namedun- I saw a part of one episode and was sickened by the shallowness of the Doctors and Trainers and the whole beutie contest thing. But I do how ever think that the make over could be a good thing. so yea.

[Croydon]

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by florida-david:
i just a tv show last night about the problems with plastic surgery and how lots of women are having their various implants removed (the lady from baywatch comes to mind). they stressed that part of the reason was how uncomfortable these out of proportion breasts were and the problems with the saline leaking and causing them to get sick. they also showed cosmetic surgery gone wrong (michael jackson, loni anderson, and joan rivers to name a few). if they were nudists i think they would be more accepting of their little imperfections and could grow old gracefully instead of as a freaky plastic doll (one woman actually made herself to look like barbie, the arch enemy of all women!!!) <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>We have to clarify a few things. Often times, patients who have major problems with plastic surgery do so because the surgeon they saw was unqualified. People forget that plastic surgery is just that, SURGERY and you want the best surgeon you can find. To do this, you must do a thorough research consisting of internet research, visiting the surgeon, checking their credentials, and seeing whether they are certified by an APPROPRIATE medical organization. Often times patients do not do the proper research and run into problems of catasthropic problems with their surgery. Plastic surgery is quite unregulated in U.S. so be careful.

In addition, in cases like Michael Jackson, Rivers and the Barbie woman, these people have a psychological disorder and that is an addiction to surgery. These people should never have had surgery in first place. Not everyone is qualified to be patients. In fact, GOOD surgeons often do a psychological evaluation of candidates before accepting patients. Plastic surgery on changes the exterior but not the interior. Yes, it can boost ones self esteem but it doesn't do that when you already have a poor self image of yourself. If that is the case, surgery will not solve anything.

Also, alot of people who go see a surgeon have unrealistic expectation as to what surgery will achieve. Many expect some major change, believe me it doesn't work that way. You can't go in looking like plane Jane and expect to end up looking like Tyra Banks. These people with unrealistic expectations are the ones who end up looking like Michael Jackson and Joan Rivers. Those are the ones who have surgery over and over again

Being a nudist has nothing to do w/ one's self image or choice to have plastic surgery. We all have something we don't like about ourselves and some can live with it and some choose to do change it. furthermore, whether a person is a nudist or not, we ALL want to look our best. I am a nudist and have had plastic surgery and am happy I did it, it is the best thing I ever did for myself.

[NuTex]

Namedun,
Thanks for bringing this up. That is so much garbage. There's a term for this kind of trash. Bread and circuses.

Makes me sick.
NuTex

[shãybare]

And textiles think we have a problem? They need a big time reality check.

[Croydon]

We are no different than textiles when it comes to body image and our desire to want to look good.

[Rex]

I agree with Croydon on this.

I would suggest that almost all of us want to "look our best", in the way which is meaningful to ourselves.

I am not "conventionally" handsome, and when I was a young man, I sometimes looked at myself, and wished that I was different, in some ways.

I was never satisfied with my hair, either.

I recognise these feelings as part of the insecurity which sometimes goes with being young, and I have outgrown them.

Two of my friends had elective plastic surgery, when I was young.

Keith had his nose altered. None of us knew why, because he was already a confident, nice looking young man, and there didn't seem to be any noticeable difference.

Dennis had his ears pinned back. Before the operation, he was, in the words of a very unkind song, "like a taxi with the doors wide open". The change in Dennis was dramatic. He was much better looking, and quickly became more confident and outgoing, and more comfortable with the girls. I know a lot of this is "all in the mind", but how we perceive ourselves is a very strong driving force.

My second wife won a number of beauty contests, and worked, at various times, as a model, dancer and dance teacher. She never even considered plastic surgery, but kept herself fit with Yoga, weight training, aerobics, tennis, squash, walking, cycling, swimming, etc.

We all need to "market" ourselves, for work, for promotion, to get a partner. What we do, and how we do it, depends on many things. Usually on how much time, effort, and perhaps money, we are prepared to invest in ourselves.

The image I have of myself, is that of a fit, strong, capable, energetic man.

I "look after myself". I've never smoked, or even tried illegal drugs. I've never been a heavy drinker, or been overweight.

I don't feel that I am "depriving myself", in any way. And I am reaping the benefits.

I dance usually four times a week, pump iron at a specialist gym, and swim every day. I can still free-dive to 20 feet or so, and swim in and out of underwater caves.

I am 70 in August, and don't hide my age, but people often assume I'm still in my fifties.

I lost my second wife nearly two years ago, and I will never forget Kathy, the love we shared, and the good times we had together, but I'm still here, and life goes on.

I have a very sweet lady friend, a ballroom dancer, who had no previous experience of nudism, but quickly took to it.

She is a lot younger than me, and looks far younger than her actual age, and has model looks and figure. In a physical, as well as an emotional sense, we suit each other fine.

I've said far more than I intended to, and I realise that some of this will come through as "blowing my own trumpet", but that is not the intention. I just think it is so important to look after your own body. Your car falls to bits, you can just go out and buy another car. Your body starts to fall to bits, you've got big trouble.

There are no certainties in life, but, through your own lifestyle choices, you can lengthen the odds, you can shorten the odds.

Back to plastic surgery. I can never understand why, if you decide to improve your mind, or your spirit, you are almost universally admired, but if you decide to improve your physical appearance with plastic surgery, or even by weight training etc, you are often criticised as vain, stupid, insecure, and so on.

Like Croydon suggests, choose a plastic surgeon carefully, if you decide to use one. After all, you choose your motor mechanic carefully, don't you, and what's more important, you or your car?

I have no intention of "growing old gracefully". Come to think of it, I don't want to hear any of that "rest in peace" nonsense either, when I get into the next bit of adventure!

[Croydon]

You couldn't have said it any better Rex. Good Job