INA promotes gambling

[luvnaturism]

Another thread has been discussing the appropriateness of ads that have been accepted in a magazine that INA distributes but doesn't publish. Now Nudes in the News is reporting that INA has taken a step that I believe will be far more detrimental to naturism than someone else's ads ever could be.

INA has bought an offshore casino in order to enter the unregulated world of internet gambling. This is already a major social problem, and now we get to have naturism connected in people's minds to an industry that is filled with sleaze.

What great things will come of this? A small portion of the profits will be used for lobbying. The bulk of it (85%) will purchase domain names to keep them from being used by pornographers...as though that would put a dent in pornography. What it will do is give INA a commodity that can be resold, so gambling profits will be used to make more profits with little obvious benefit to naturism.

[luvnaturism]

Another thread has been discussing the appropriateness of ads that have been accepted in a magazine that INA distributes but doesn't publish. Now Nudes in the News is reporting that INA has taken a step that I believe will be far more detrimental to naturism than someone else's ads ever could be.

INA has bought an offshore casino in order to enter the unregulated world of internet gambling. This is already a major social problem, and now we get to have naturism connected in people's minds to an industry that is filled with sleaze.

What great things will come of this? A small portion of the profits will be used for lobbying. The bulk of it (85%) will purchase domain names to keep them from being used by pornographers...as though that would put a dent in pornography. What it will do is give INA a commodity that can be resold, so gambling profits will be used to make more profits with little obvious benefit to naturism.

[Corky]

Sure, buying nudist and naturist domains might not put a dent in the porn industry but it will disassociate us from them when someone types naturists.com, swimsuitsoptional.com, naturistclubs.com, etc.

There has been gambling on nude cruises for years and none of the profits were set aside to help the cause. Also, there are many raffles held by both TNS and AANR. Casino nights are extremely popular at many nudist resorts. This is just a test fund raiser approved by the INA and the NAC. Money is needed very badly and we are joining forces to help. MGM movie studios opened a casino in Las Vegas and it hasn't hurt their movie business.

To many people, nudism is more controversial than casinos. I think we need to work on educating the public on that issue. We need to try to be more open and accept funding from more sources including casinos. The NAC will not be linking back to the casino, but if people are already at the casino they can donate money directly or by playing games.

We take you input very seriously and are monitoring the casino and all responses to decide if the casino's income will help fund our cause and how much is outweighs any negatives.

Corky Stanton

[Trailscout]

Many churches have taken official stances against casino gambling and even state lottery gambling, which directs some of its profits to education.

By choosing to invest in casinos INA and TNS have chosen a path that many people (not just Christians) consider immoral.

I have found ample Biblical support for the virtue of being nude when possible. I cannot find scriptural justification for gambling.

Sorry INA, I just can't back you on this one.

[Gord]

Somepeople, as we all know, consider nudity immoral. Who cares what some churches think of gambling or whether there's any "scriptural justification"? What does a church's stance or what the Bible says (or doesn't say) have to do with anything? If you don't like something--gambling, drinking, nudism, whatever--fine, don't do it! Maybe this weekend I'll have a beer, sunbathe nude, and buy a lottery ticket. And I live in the Bible Belt, too.

[Trailscout]

Gord,
I am having a beer right now and I am trying to type fast before it goes to my head!

We both live in Georgia and we have a state-run lottery, a form of gambling, so clearly the majority of people agree with you on this one.

I am just trying to say that nudists have a hard enough time without taking on any more controversy.

I personally don't care if you gamble or not. It is fun, as long as you don't lose too much.

As for "scriptural justification", a lot of us who are both Christians and nudists do care what the Bible has to say about our lifestyle. God and the Bible have no problem with nudity by the way. It is 21st Century Churches that have often decided to go contrary to the Bible that are the problem.

By the way, the Bible doesn't forbid me to drink beer and isn't there some verse that says, "finish what you start"? So if you will excuse me, I need to get back to my Dos Equis!

[TXK NUDE]

While drinking beer may not be forbidden bu Scripture, being drunk is. In fact, drunkeness is considered to be a VERY serious flaw! So before you 'finish' yourself off...you might want to consider that many churches, religious organizations, and socio-political action groups (i.e. MADD) DO consider drinking of any kind to be a sign of moral failure.

And, for that scripture that says'finish what you start' you might want to check your concordance again...the only reference I can find is where God finishes the work HE began in us! Be careful when you quote scriptures that don't exist!

Now, to INA owning a gambling casino...while many churches do stand against it...and scripture DOES advocate that a person be good stewards of what they have...and gambling does seem to be a little like NOT being a good steward...it's nto really banned by the Bible, what should we care?

Gambling in Las Vegas, Indain Reservations, and VFA halls is considered bad by society because it takes money from people who need it for food, diapers, etc. It's also been connected to organized crime, and all that stuff that the Mob has been connected with in other areas...porn, prostitution, drugs, etc.

Now, if INA can use this money to HELP nudism, and there is no prostitution, drugs, or other 'sins' connected to it, can it be that bad?

Now...I am not crazy about gambling, drinking excessively, porn, prostitution, or any of that stuff. But i recognize that lotteries, raffles, and some gambling can be beneficial to communities, organizations, or clubs. As long as it's donw responsibly, it should be alright. Albeit, I won't be contributing from my meager paycheck to gambling. i have food, diapers, clothing, rent, bills, car insurance...etc, etc, etc,

[Trailscout]

TXK,
When I say I want to finish, I meant the bottle! I usually finish a 6 pack in two weeks or more!

I don't enjoy gambling but I can understand that some might enjoy a game of chance.

There's always a few compulsive types who blow their mortgage money on the "next lucky break" that never comes.

I think INA can find better and less controversial investments. Dispite my joking, it is a serious matter and I don't support this latest venture of theirs into casinos.

[Bartamus]

T&K Nude: Thanks for your support. I think
you realize the benefit of our gambling site
as it relates to promoting naturist beaches
and wilderness areas.

Trailscout: I'm sorry you don't agree.
However, Corky has decided to stick with our
new venture and we have the support of the
Naturist Society

[RT]

I feel the urge to have my 5 cents worth.

We have Casino's in every capital city in Australia and the majority of the profits go to the government to pay for public hospitals, education etc...

Although we need hospitals and public education Gambling causes a lot of social issues and a lot of credit problems for young families. I don't think buying a casino is a good idea as it only promotes gambling.

In theory what INA intends doing with the money is an awesome idea I thing there is better ways of raising money.

Well, thats enough of my cheese and crackers.

RT

[Trailscout]

Bart,
I have one request: Please post a link on your Casino Web site to any organization you can find that can help those who become addicted to gambling.

I realize that a game of chance is harmless fun for most, but some people will overdo it and may need help.

[Corky]

There already is a link to Gambler's Anonymous on the "About Us" page. It goes to: http://www.gamblersanonymous.org to help those who might have a problem with it.

What other fund raisers does anyone have in mind to raise money for the cause? We are very open to more ideas.

Corky

The problem isn't with the gambling. It's with people who have no self-control. I'm one of those people. If I enjoy something, I want to go all the way. I don't gamble for that reason. However, I see nothing wrong with gambling as long as a person doesn't take food out of the mouths of his family in order to gamble, or bet the rent money. to each his own. /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

[Nate Dekan]

Trailscout, I'll see your "I cannot find scriptural justification for gambling." and raise you Acts 1:26 where the apostles gambled to choose a replacement for Judas! /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Sorry, I couldn't resist, I have seen other examples of gambling in scripture that was not condemned, but can't think of them right now. Frankly I'm not interested much in the subject, I can see valid reasons to stay away from gambling apart from "scriptural justification" (Sorry Corky). As well as valid reasons to use it for fundraising, some churches have been doing that with Bingo nights for ages.

It's this "scriptural justification" thing that gets me and why I'm responding. I've moved my post regarding this to the Nudity & Religion section for those who are interested.

Nate

[Trailscout]

Nate,

Nate, for most of us, we can regard a certain percentage of our income as disposable. Gambling is harmless entertainment in my estimation as long as you limit yourself to the "fun money" you have budgeted. Having said all this, I had really hoped to leave out my personal opinions about the morality of gambling.

You ignored my major premise: Many church groups and some non-religious people are opposed to gambling on moral grounds. In view of this opposition, I content that INA should avoid the controversy of involvement in gambling. Advocating social nudity is controversy enough without adding fuel to the fire by taking on other "hot" issues.

I will reply to your comments on scriptural justification in the other thread.

[Nate Dekan]

Trailscout said: "Advocating social nudity is controversy enough without adding fuel to the fire by taking on other "hot" issues."

I agree, for this reason I do try to keep my opinions more to myself on non-related "hot" issues (I will however recommend an excellent and very long book that can be read online. called "Ain't Nodody's Business If You Do". Of course I don't agree with everything in it, just most of it. /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif It's at: http://www.mcwilliams.com/books/books/aint/ The chapter on Prohibition is excellent, in many ways I feel that this book is in agreement with the Bible in that the more you legeslate against - rather than educate about - things the more tempting those things become to people.). However, with church bingo nights, poker, lotteries, Indian gaming, Los Vegas, etc. I really don't think gambling is that high on the hot list.

Some people will be offended by anything, it's simply impossible to live your live, run a business, promote a cause, etc. and not offend someone about something. No, it's not wise to go out of your way to offend large numbers of people, you won't get very far that way, but right or wrong I don't think gambling is that offensive to uper large numbers of people. I think the people who would be very offended by it would also be very offended by nudity, so nothing is really lost.

Nate

I certainly would have preferred that INA to have stayed away from the gambling issue. We need not get involved into the ethics. But I guess I agree most with Trailscoat.

I have seen so many people really get hurt and thier families hurt as a result of gambling. I personally despise having to go through the Las Vagas airport -- Reno is slightly better.

It seems to me that you just gave the opponents of decent naturism another target to shoot at. Sure, some denominations have used bingo for years; most of the public now accept the state lotteries (I've voted against them several times -- won once).

Corky has likewise asked for postive suggestions for alternative means to raise funds and at this moment none comes to mind. I have suggested to another poster that there be a conference sometime in the next few months of a dozen or so people to address this issue and more importantly means to get the message out. I certainly agree that everything costs money and if we are going to influence public opinion in the US towards acceptance of naturism, it has to be done professionally and it "ain't going to come cheap."

Bill Martin, Venice, FL

[luvnaturism]

I started this thread, and I see that my original concern has been overlooked. Evidently I didn't communicate clearly, so let me try again.

I'm not a fan of gambling, but neither do I see it as a moral issue for those who keep it within the limits of what they can afford to lose.

Offshore internet casinos are unregulated and operate without effective oversight. They have proven themselves particularly open to abuse and to abusive activity. My expectation is that sometime in the next few years we're going to have a lot of negative publicity about this emerging social issue, and INA may well be prominantly featured...whether the publcity is deserved or not.

Had INA chosen to buy a piece of a Nevada casino I wouldn't have been thrilled, but I wouldn't have bothered to write about it either. Nevada casinos are carefully monitored, and are
relatively free of abusive activity.

My view is that INA could have taken a different route to obtain the investment benefit that they seek.