How much do you know about AANR?

I'm interested in knowing how much actual AANR members know about their own organization. Were you aware that the president of AANR was trying to do a major overhaul called AANR Tomorrow?

Are you an AANR member only because your club forces you to join? Do you vote for delegates to represent you at the conventions? Do you care that most delegates are appointed by the clubs instead of holding elections? Do you realize that this means most of the delegates represent the clubs and not it's members? Do you also realize that us members pay dues and the clubs pay nothing and yet get to decide how AANR is run?

I'm interested in knowing how much actual AANR members know about their own organization. Were you aware that the president of AANR was trying to do a major overhaul called AANR Tomorrow?

Are you an AANR member only because your club forces you to join? Do you vote for delegates to represent you at the conventions? Do you care that most delegates are appointed by the clubs instead of holding elections? Do you realize that this means most of the delegates represent the clubs and not it's members? Do you also realize that us members pay dues and the clubs pay nothing and yet get to decide how AANR is run?

[soundman]

What is AANR tomorrow?

http://cb.aanr.com/aanr_tomorrow.php

It was what the president Pat Brown wanted to change AANR into. There is lots to read about there so I won't bore everyone with it here but I hope enough people are motivated to find out just what it was about.

[NoodJuggler]

What is that they say..Money talks. Why should they care about the little guy, you might pay dues but the clubs will benifit them more than me or you. So the clubs are going to get the most out of it. I didn't read everything but it seems like the little guy is getting the shaft. If you don't like what they are doing just don't pay your dues, if enough people don't then they might listen. It is all political crap anyway..Just my opinion, I could care less anymore. It's their game and I don't play by their rules so I lose..Keithmj /infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

[mel]

I'm a member of TNS. I don't know if that's better than AANR, but they have a magazine they mail out every three months. They discuss what's happening in the nudist world and have articles on different places to go. I find it very interesting.

[Trailscout]

You can get a discount at most local nudist clubs with either an AANR or TNS membership card. TNS membership is a little cheaper and has a nice members magazine. AANR just publishes a newsletter.

TNS has a wing (Naturist Action Committee) that works in court to protect our rights on nude beaches and other public nude situations.

AANR is far from perfect, but it provides some accountability for resorts. Some people never go to nudist resorts or campgrounds and may not care about being a member, but if you go to nudist resorts, being a member of AANR is your only hope of influencing the future of them. Ironically if AANR Tomorrow had passed, individuals would have little or no future role to play in AANR. The clubs would run it and the leadership would have been centralized. Yeah, you could get disgusted and walk off, but if you did, that would immediately hand victory to the people who want to prevent you from having a voice in the running of nudist resorts and campgrounds.

AANR has established summer camps for kids and teens and that is the best thing they have ever done. No matter what you think of AANR's leadership, this program for young people needs all the support and encouragement we can give.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Keithmj:
If you don't like what they are doing just don't pay your dues, if enough people don't then they might listen. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Well I know now that you don't belong to any of the clubs in the area because if you did you'd know that most of them force you to join AANR when you join them.

If I want to attend Como and Caliente I have to fork over for an AANR membership too. If this rule was removed AANR would lose about half it's members.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Trailscout:
You can get a discount at most local nudist clubs with either an AANR or TNS membership card. TNS membership is a little cheaper and has a nice members magazine. AANR just publishes a newsletter.

TNS has a wing (Naturist Action Committee) that works in court to protect our rights on nude beaches and other public nude situations.

AANR is far from perfect, but it provides some accountability for resorts. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It does? If that is true how come they don't do anything about the swingers playing in the pools late at night at Paradise? How come other small clubs have been thrown out for the same behavior? Because Paradise is their greatest source of income, that's why.

Oh, and TNS is not cheaper for singles than AANR. TNS has one membership price so families would save but singles would not. Having said that, most clubs force you to join after a few visits so that discount is rather meaningless since you'd only save about $2-4 per visit. Now if you travel a lot you can use it.

And NAC isn't the only source of protection from bad legislation... AANR does the same thing although I think NAC does a better job. I've been a NAC area rep and still work with NAC now and then, going to county meetings and speaking before commissioners to try and preserve what we have. I firmly believe that anyone that considers themselves nudists should be giving money to NAC instead of making a few of us do all the work for the rest. If you don't you are mooching off the sweat of us few that keep nudism alive.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Some people never go to nudist resorts or campgrounds and may not care about being a member, but if you go to nudist resorts, being a member of AANR is your only hope of influencing the future of them. Ironically if AANR Tomorrow had passed, individuals would have little or no future role to play in AANR. The clubs would run it and the leadership would have been centralized. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>AANR Tomorrow allowed half the delegates to be elected by members and the other half by clubs so your statement isn't true.


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR> Yeah, you could get disgusted and walk off, but if you did, that would immediately hand victory to the people who want to prevent you from having a voice in the running of nudist resorts and campgrounds. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>No, many of us can't walk off because our clubs force AANR membership on us. Please, post about what you know.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
AANR has established summer camps for kids and teens and that is the best thing they have ever done. No matter what you think of AANR's leadership, this program for young people needs all the support and encouragement we can give. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Except that AANR didn't establish those camps. FANR did. After ten years of sucessfully running them AANR is finally pitching in and helping. FANR runs it's treasury dry every year paying for kids to go to that camp. AANR didn't help them.

Your post is full of misinformation. I suggest you read the link a bit before adding more bad info to this discussion.

[Trailscout]

Cyndiann,

I cannot prove that Paradise is getting off scot free because of the money their membership injects, but typically when you look for wrongdoing you follow the money motive. What you said is believable.

My premise is that an association of resorts makes sense if it means that they can hold their member resorts to standards of quality, service and to some extent policy.
I am not here to conjecture on the level to which AANR is effective. I am simply saying that there doesn't seem to be an alternative association which can influence resorts for the benefit of us the visitors. If you can suggest an alternate way for rank and file nudists to influence resorts for the better, I am glad to hear your ideas.
If AANR is our only outlet for dissent, we had better join or they will never change for the better.

I agree that contributing money to NAC is extremely important. I think that naturism would also benefit from some grass-roots action. Specificially, I mean supportive visits to beaches that are traditionally (but not officially) nude.

I also think that letters written by individuals to elected officials carry weight

What is your position on AANR Tomorrow? Do you think it would have been of any benefit to the individual?

Do clubs force AANR membership on you or is TNS membership an acceptable alternative?

Where I live, I am not under obligation to join my local resort. They allow unlimited visits.

Is FANR funding the youth camp at White Tail Park in Virginia? If not, was AANR East? or AANR?

For now, I am only a TNS member. If my money situation improves, I could either join AANR in addition to TNS or remain a TNS member only and send additional funds to NAC. I would welcome any information you and others can provide to help me make that decision.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Trailscout:
Cyndiann,

I cannot prove that Paradise is getting off scot free because of the money their membership injects, but typically when you look for wrongdoing you follow the money motive. What you said is believable.

My premise is that an association of resorts makes sense if it means that they can hold their member resorts to standards of quality, service and to some extent policy.
I am not here to conjecture on the level to which AANR is effective. I am simply saying that there doesn't seem to be an alternative association which can influence resorts for the benefit of us the visitors. If you can suggest an alternate way for rank and file nudists to influence resorts for the better, I am glad to hear your ideas.
If AANR is our only outlet for dissent, we had better join or they will never change for the better. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>One of two things needs to happen. Either AANR needs to become a member driven organization with the clubs' influence at the least reduced if not eliminated or the members need to drop out of AANR and let them sink. As you can see from the poll I did most nudists, event AANR members have no clue what is going on and don't get involved with AANR politics, which is what lead to the clubs running the show because when they had elections nobody voted and the clubs ended up choosing delegates.

Because of this situation clubs can continue to ignore singles and other issues important to nudists. We have no bite to our bark.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
I agree that contributing money to NAC is extremely important. I think that naturism would also benefit from some grass-roots action. Specificially, I mean supportive visits to beaches that are traditionally (but not officially) nude.

I also think that letters written by individuals to elected officials carry weight

What is your position on AANR Tomorrow? Do you think it would have been of any benefit to the individual? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It would have given more control to members but not enough. It would have legally given half the control to clubs while now they legally have none even though they are physically in control. There were other flaws as well. I would not be for this.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Do clubs force AANR membership on you or is TNS membership an acceptable alternative?

Where I live, I am not under obligation to join my local resort. They allow unlimited visits.

Is FANR funding the youth camp at White Tail Park in Virginia? If not, was AANR East? or AANR?

For now, I am only a TNS member. If my money situation improves, I could either join AANR in addition to TNS or remain a TNS member only and send additional funds to NAC. I would welcome any information you and others can provide to help me make that decision. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>TNS is not an alternative to AANR at most clubs. Many take either card but it is AANR that gives incentives to clubs to have 100% AANR membership. The clubs get some benefits but not much really, not enough to justify us having to pay AANR so much.

If you don't have to join AANR I think TNS is superior in many ways including how they fight their political battles. NAC doesn't get membership money like AANR's Governmental Affairs does. NAC survives only on donations and does one hell of a lot with very little. They work with grass roots people and have a lot of volunteers.

[NudeAl]

I must admit to having a very limited exposure to AANR but I am a member of TNS. I do like their approach in that they tend to include the Free beach movement,i.e. more public nude beaches etc., in what they are lobbying for. I Feel the AANR is more or less just out to promote themselves, and the owners of the resorts.

[Frank R]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by cyndiann:

For my money, I think Cyndiann is one of, if the the, best informed people on the board. This doesn't mean that I agree with her on everything but on nudist issues, I think she is an excellent source of information and one that I rely on.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>My premise is that an association of resorts makes sense if it means that they can hold their member resorts to standards of quality, service and to some extent policy. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>There is an association of resorts called TANR. They don't need AANR too.

[FireProf]

We are members of AANR and also members of TNS, INA and Friends of San Onofre Beach. We do not belong to any clubs because we don't want to feel like we have to go to one place and enjoy our lifestyle. Many clubs around here will only let you visit 2-3 times before you MUST join.

We enjoy meeting lots of people and feel joining a club will force us to visit only that one club. I don't understand why these clubs force you to join. If they allowed my wife and I to visit occasionally throughout the year, they would probably make more money off us on day use fees then if we joined.

I admit to not knowing all the politics surrounding AANR tomorrow and how if affects clubs. I do know that I support all nudist/naturists groups, organizations and web sites that continue to work hard to ensure I can still have places to visit and live my lifestyle.

We are grateful for the likes of Cyndiann, Cheri, and others who post information and share it with us. We appreciate the effort and time all of you donate daily to keep us informed. /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

[Trailscout]

Fireprof,

I live 5-6 hours away from a beach where nudity is possible because of its remoteness, maybe 7 hours from the central Florida nude beaches. Other people are even further away from nude beaches and their nude recreation opportunities are further diminished by the cold winters on the mid-Atlantic and New England shores.

By contrast, I live 2 hours or less from 4 nudist resorts in North Georgia. I think many other people find themselves in nearly the same situation, that is, where joining a resort is the only practical way to enjoy social nudity with a few amenities.

Well, there is one alternative for those who are better described as naturist hikers and campers than as resort-goers: Form a travel club (formally or informally) and enjoy the camaraderie of social nudism in a true wilderness setting.

I don't know what percentage of nudists are home nudists who rarely if ever go to resorts. I have seen anecdotal evidence from posts on this forum and from people I have met, that there are quite a few of them.

[shãybare]

Distance from beaches and clubs are definitely a hindrance for alot of nudists. Finances are also hard for some. I certainly agree with you, FireProf, About having to join after only a couple of visits. My situation is just that I can't get away all the time. OakLake Trails in Depew, OK is the closest resort for me and I would be able to go 3 or 4 times a year during holidays but OLT has the rule of two visits only and then you have to join. For me that isn't very econmical.

[FireProf]

I really think that clubs should look at this policy of mandatory memberships after a few visits. They are turning away lots of money annually from those of us that can't or don't want to join, but are willing to pay the day use gate fees, eat at their snack bars and restaurants and enjoy the facilities. /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

The main reasons clubs make membership mandatory are to make money and to be allowed to call themselves private clubs. A private club can discriminate against singles and whomever because they are private.

What is required in the US to be called a private club is quite different from what is required in the UK from what I have learned from the UK people on this board. Clubs in the UK have to be a lot more restrictive on aquiring new members and can't advertise. The clubs in the US have taken the definition of private to the liberal max and would most likely not be considered legally private if put to the test by a single man that was refused entrance and who would take this through our court systems. All we need is a test case. /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

One more point about club memberships... a few clubs around here have two levels of membership. For those who don't visit often there is the Associates Membership which costs a lot less and you'd pay a reduced day fee. Do the clubs in your area have that?

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Frank R:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by cyndiann:

For my money, I think Cyndiann is one of, if the the, best informed people on the board. This doesn't mean that I agree with her on everything but on nudist issues, I think she is an excellent source of information and one that I rely on. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Thanks Frank! /infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[Bob S.]

First to answer cyndiann's original question, I know enough to be informed, but not enough to make myself dangerous. For that, I'll rely on both Cheri and cyndiann. Thanks!

Second, I am not too sure about the AANR-ER Youth Leadership Camp at White Tail, but I know that there was a fairly good sized fee for the parents and I think they based at least part of it on their Juniorfest, which White Tail puts on every June. Although that is a weekend get-together where the kids actually stay with their parents.

Also, keep in mind that White Tail has a position of Youth Activities Coordinator (paid maybe) so they are used to child activities.

Third, I like White Tail Park's membership policy. It is that you must have made at least five visits before you can apply for membership.

Bob S.

[R.M. Greenman]

Years ago I started a club called P.U.N. POOR URBAN NUDISTS This was to encourage people who couldn't afford to join a club or afford the time to make the dues worth it to enjoy nude sunbathing and socializing for practically free. It was kind or a B.Y.O. everything event. Lately I haven't had the time to organize anything. /infopop/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif /infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Bob S.:
Second, I am not too sure about the AANR-ER Youth Leadership Camp at White Tail, but I know that there was a fairly good sized fee for the parents and I think they based at least part of it on their Juniorfest, which White Tail puts on every June. Although that is a weekend get-together where the kids actually stay with their parents.

Bob S. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Yes, most kids pay to attend the AANR camps but in addition there are some at the Florida camp that are always sponsored by FANR that normally wouldn't be able to go. I'd imagine that the other camps have kids that get to go in the same manner.

[Snoboy]

Cindiann is knowledgeable about everything. Just ask her. /infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

[FireProf]

I don't have a problem with a club wanting to get to know you better before they grant you membership. I think that's a good idea to have you visit a number of times before you apply. You get to see the club and the people and decide if that is the right club for you.

I don't like the idea of them demanding you join after 2-3 visits just to get the membership money out of you. They can make more money off you if they just allow you to day visit as many times as you like as long as you are a member of some nudist/naturist organization. /infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

The whole purpose of this thread was to show how involved people are in what goes on in AANR. The clubs have taken over the major decision making but only because enough members didn't get involved enough to even vote for a delegate to represent them. Nobody was showing up to vote or nobody volunteered to be a candidate so clubs started appointing people to go and many times the ones appointed were club managers or employees. This has resulted in an organization that is paid for by us members and run by the clubs that don't have to pay a dime and in fact get monetary benefits from AANR in the form of free advertising and other perks.

AANR Tomorrow was supposed to be a way of fixing this problem. It gave half the votes to the clubs and half to the members. I think what happened is that the members weren't content with getting half back and wanted full control again. There were some other major flaws in it as well. Many didn't want to see their regional organizations cut loose and felt that they would not have a personal connection without them. I think it was a good try but still with some major flaws that need addressing.

I am hoping that Pat Brown keeps her word and works on a more advanced version right away.

[shãybare]

I just found out about a club that is about 80 mi. from where I live. I plan to check it out this weekend. I downloaded their Rules & Guidelines and their prices. The first sentence says: "Guests must become members after one initial visit, if returning. Exception: Special invitation." I personally do not like to join a specific club. I like to visit several clubs during the year. It isnt very economical to join several clubs. I wouldn't mind joining a club if other clubs would recognize that membership and not make you join their club also.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by shaybare:
I just found out about a club that is about 80 mi. from where I live. I plan to check it out this weekend. I downloaded their Rules & Guidelines and their prices. The first sentence says: "Guests must become members after one initial visit, if returning. Exception: Special invitation." I personally do not like to join a specific club. I like to visit several clubs during the year. It isnt very economical to join several clubs. I wouldn't mind joining a club if other clubs would recognize that membership and not make you join their club also. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Some clubs do just that. The ones here in Land O Lakes do... and many times you get a discount if you go into one club while belonging to another one. Another way around joining them is to find out how far they hold you to this rule. I know many have a 100 mile limit and if you live more than 100 miles away they won't force you to join and you can visit as many times as you want as long as you have an AANR or TNS card.

[shãybare]

Thanks for the info, cyndiann. I will check this with the clubs I usually attend.