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  • Drones spying nudists?

    What will surveillance drones in US skies mean for naturists?

    An article in the International Herald Tribune today says that a law signed by President Barack Obama on Tuesday will compel the FAA "to allow drones to be used for all sorts of commercial endeavors — from selling real estate and dusting crops, to monitoring oil spills and wildlife, to surveying damage from hurricanes, even to shooting Hollywood films. The police and emergency services will be freer to send up their own drones." IHT quotes Ryan Calo, director of privacy and robotics at the Center for Internet and Society at Stanford University, worrying that ‘‘as privacy law stands today, you don’t have a reasonable expectation of privacy while out in public, nor almost anywhere visible from a public vantage. I don’t think this doctrine makes sense...’’ The article asks: " Can a drone flying over a house pick up heat from a lamp used to grow marijuana inside, for instance, or take pictures from outside someone’s third floor fire escape? Can images taken from a drone be sold to a third party, and how long can they be kept?" The specific rules evidently haven't been figured out yet. Randy Mcdaniel, chief of the sheriff’s department in Conroe, Texas, near Houston, whose agency purchased a drone to use for law-enforcement operations, is quoted as saying that concerns about privacy are overblown, "everyone, everywhere can be photographed with cellphone cameras anyway." Yes, but there are sometimes fences or other stuff in the way for us non-drone cellphone photographers...

    Personally, I don't mind being photographed nude in my backyard by a drone. Well, as long as it's not used to enforce some "public" indecency law. Maybe AANR/TNS/NAC should make a few phone calls to make sure that friendly naturists are protected. More optimistically, maybe the advent of domestic drones will make being photographed nude so common that sheriffs won't bother following up and legislators consequently will have to decide more clearly what "public" actually means and what, photographed or otherwise, specifically constitutes doing something "indecent."

    At least, thanks to the real estate drones, new neighbours will know in advance that there are naturists living next door. On the other hand, why am I more comfortable with the thought of overhead Obama Drones than overhead Santorum Drones?
    Last edited by Agde; 02-17-2012, 01:26 PM.

  • #2
    Re: Drones spying nudists?

    Santorum drones will be armed (and controlled from Dick Cheney's bunker)

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    • #3
      Re: Drones spying nudists?

      I think they'd have a hard time saying that we're "indecent". It'd be like someone telling God that what he created is indecent.

      Think the only way to be indecent is to act indecently, not just to be naked.

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      • #4
        Re: Drones spying nudists?

        The drone manufacturing industry expects to sell 30,000 surveillance drones for use within the United States in the next 8 years.
        Last December the Stanford Law Review published an article that says that existing privacy laws are so weak that they will in no way inhibit the widespread use of surveillance drones to spy on private property - but they suggest that they might very well spur privacy advocates to change the laws to increase privacy rights. Others suggest that Americans have become so used to the idea of no personal privacy that it won't even be an issue.

        Just think how safe nudist resorts will be in 8 years when the local sheriff departments have drones circling overhead 24/7. The nudists will know whenever something is happening elsewhere in the county by noting the absence of the drones over the nudist park.

        Here's a story with a bunch of related links: Keep Your Drones Outta My Face

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        • #5
          Re: Drones spying nudists?

          Privacy? Satellites have been taking photos since the Vietnam war era. They have been used in all sorts of spy activity and have super accurate cameras. The drones will be nothing new, perhaps just cheaper.

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          • #6
            Re: Drones spying nudists?

            Originally posted by naturalmanwa View Post
            Privacy? Satellites have been taking photos since the Vietnam war era. They have been used in all sorts of spy activity and have super accurate cameras. The drones will be nothing new, perhaps just cheaper.
            True, but military satellites are not looking for dress code violations in people's backyards, and the 1 to 3 meter resolution coverage available to corporations and non-military users didn't really violate personal privacy.

            Those Google Earth images that show naked people on rooftops etc. who clearly expected privacy are from aerial imagery, not satellite. Drone imagery is equivalent to this, and with 30,000 of them flying around they are going to be ubiquitous - and far from only being in the hands of the military, they will be in the hands of local Sheriff's deputies, corporations, news organizations, and probably internet entrepreneurs who will let you control the cameras from a website. In the brave new world of constant aerial drone surveillance, there will be no such thing as a privacy fence or secluded nudist park or beach.

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            • #7
              Re: Drones spying nudists?

              My Problem is this: Who is paying for these Drones? The Tax Payer? They are talking about this in Canada , as well.

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              • #8
                Re: Drones spying nudists?

                This is where we buy signal jammers for our property so that any low flying drones crash land while they are trespassing.

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                • #9
                  Re: Drones spying nudists?

                  Originally posted by Archaewok1 View Post
                  This is where we buy signal jammers for our property so that any low flying drones crash land while they are trespassing.
                  We don't own the air above us so they can never trespass. The FCC disallows signal jammers, I believe.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Drones spying nudists?

                    Originally posted by Edmontonnudist View Post
                    My Problem is this: Who is paying for these Drones? The Tax Payer? They are talking about this in Canada , as well.
                    Government at all levels. This is part of the extension of military industrial complex to state and local governments - the same that has brought us police departments with tanks, weapons and the militarization of police in the US. Military contractors make a lot of money now selling to local governments (often with grant money from Homeland Security). This will undoubtedly be the same, but these drones are also going to be sold to private companies - anyone who now uses small aircraft and helicopters for aerial photography, surveillance, prospecting etc. And definitely broadcast news. Think of all the news helicopters over LA multiplied by 100.

                    All of this will depend on the FAA changing rules concerning low level flight, particularly over populated areas. It is already in the works, and there is big money from defense contractors behind it.

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                    • #11
                      Re: Drones spying nudists?

                      Not only should anyone wanting to get away to an empty beach (or PlayaLinda) be concerned, All Americans should be concerned. I can see this heading to the Supreme Court by 2015. Wait until they try to introduce evidence in a big case and the judge asks for the warrant to invade the private property. It's no different that spying on people, unless you have just cause, it's against the law. I can see these being used over rural areas looking for dope growers and being shot down by the dozen. If I lived in the country and someone was flying one of these in range, I'd blast it out of the sky. Unfortunately we have so many officers who look at every civilian as guilty, that the very idea of using these for general use is going to happen. I wonder if they will ever be used to look into company property for illegal dumping? I'm sure TMZ is trying to figure out how to get a fleet of them to watch stars at home 24/7.

                      Although, I can see some good use for these. Why not use them to patrol the border at night? Offshore drug running spotters? How about search and rescue operations? Forest fire watches? Amazing little buggers that can have some very good use in the right hands and be very bad in the wrong hands.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Drones spying nudists?

                        Originally posted by BinCo View Post
                        Although, I can see some good use for these. Why not use them to patrol the border at night? Offshore drug running spotters? How about search and rescue operations? Forest fire watches? Amazing little buggers that can have some very good use in the right hands and be very bad in the wrong hands.
                        That is already happening - Cattle rustlers were caught using drones that a North Dakota Sheriff's department got on loan from the border patrol.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Drones spying nudists?

                          Originally posted by Naturist Mark View Post
                          That is already happening - Cattle rustlers were caught using drones that a North Dakota Sheriff's department got on loan from the border patrol.
                          Where is the Republican outrage???? Using PUBLIC funding to protect PRIVATE property, wow, sounds like a waste of money.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Drones spying nudists?

                            Originally posted by BinCo View Post
                            Where is the Republican outrage???? Using PUBLIC funding to protect PRIVATE property, wow, sounds like a waste of money.
                            It sounds like the government picking Winners and Losers! Just like the Fascists do!

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                            • #15
                              Re: Drones spying nudists?

                              At least drones clearly bring to light the rather upside-down legal concept of "reasonable expectation of privacy." The new Google policies (starting March 1) are like the electronic equivalent of drones. If surveillance, aerial or electronic, is so pervasive that nobody can reasonably expect privacy, then isn't everybody logically relieved of any obligation to act distinctly different in public than in private? Which mode wins? Will the paranoid sleep in their street clothes? Will the carefree remain nude on the way to the mailbox? Can naturists open their blinds and enjoy their gardens nude since they have no expectation of privacy anyway? Can non-naturists reasonably expect their naturist neighbors to be "private" about nudity if drone photos have already made their nudity "public"?

                              Privacy has aspects of secrecy, discretion, disclosure, personal sovereignty, and basically just some personal space free from hassle by others. If there are no secrets, then protection for the capture, retention, and use of personal/private information needs to be clarified and reinforced. This also raises the issue of who has access to "private" information -- only Google advertisers and the government?, also insurance companies? or everybody? Shouldn't I have access to all my drone footage and Google info? Shouldn't I be able to control who sees what about me? Or maybe we just decide to require that all drone footage is streamed live to the web so that nobody has privileged access, and then concentrate on controlling how what kinds of info can be used?

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