Florida (and national) topfreedom soon?

Macanudist · #1 11-02-2003, 02:26 AM

The "Nudes in the News" section has a link to the following article about yet another appeal in Florida to overturn laws banning women's topfreedom...

Florida topfreedom appeal

This differs from previous legal action in that it is targeted at the federal level and appeals the fact that due process was not followed earlier. The cast of characters is growing though and I hope the tide of change carries this movement ahead. Does this appeal have a chance? If it passes, what does that mean for the rest of the country? These are exciting times we live in...

Macanudist · #2 11-02-2003, 02:26 AM

The "Nudes in the News" section has a link to the following article about yet another appeal in Florida to overturn laws banning women's topfreedom...

Florida topfreedom appeal

This differs from previous legal action in that it is targeted at the federal level and appeals the fact that due process was not followed earlier. The cast of characters is growing though and I hope the tide of change carries this movement ahead. Does this appeal have a chance? If it passes, what does that mean for the rest of the country? These are exciting times we live in...

2RK · #3 11-02-2003, 01:41 PM

It's been legal in Ohio for women to go topless any where a man can for some time now but I have yet to see any women take advantage (sp?) of this fact. I think they may fear harassment by uninformed peace officers. Oh well, guess only time will tell.

aunaturelone · #4 11-07-2003, 07:47 PM

Been legal in NY and in Ontario too. Nobody there taking advantage of it. Of course in NY and Ontario, for 2/3 of the year you wouldn't want to. The Florida climate is more hospitable, both in temperature and the number of fine beaches available.

I expect the reluctance is due to social pressure. Nobody wants to be in the vanguard if all it gets you is a ration of static from police, politicians and pervs. And nudist types are notorious about hiding in the closet.

If nobody ever takes advantage of it, the favorable ruling is in danger of being lost and forgotten. I bet if you asked the women of NY if it was illegal to go topless, 99% would say it wasn't.

OTOH if nobody takes advanatge of it right now, there is little danger of any attempt to legislate the discriminatory laws back into existance. It will still be there in a future that may be more topless tolerant.

Difficult to say what the optimal strategy would be. The REAL question is how to make top free fashionable. Once enough women do it, even if only experimentally, it will become inoffensive and unremarkable.

In any event, I dont think a Federal court is an approriate place to go. You should always fight your case through the state courts first. There is ZERO chance they will win all the way to the Supreme Court (SCOTUS). There is already a recent SCOTUS ruling supporting ordinances that require female dancers to wear pasties with no requirement that men do so. This precedent indicates a different standard for dress between men and women is acceptable to them.

When the topfree ten lose in federal court they'll set a bad precedent re. the 14th amendment which ALL state courts will be required to follow. They should have started out in the FL courts which are substantially more liberal than the federal court system.

Naturist Mark · #5 11-07-2003, 09:02 PM

quote:
Originally posted by aunaturelone:
[qb]
When the topfree ten lose in federal court they'll set a bad precedent re. the 14th amendment which ALL state courts will be required to follow. They should have started out in the FL courts which are substantially more liberal than the federal court system. [/qb]

That has already been done in the Florida courts in 1999. Unlike the Federal government, Florida has an equal rights amendment - passed by the voters of the State of Florida - that guarantees equality of men and women before the law. Unfortunately the Florida courts have ruled that this State constitutional amendment does not mean what it plainly says it means, and thus women do not have equal rights under Florida law. You couldn't even make this up. PDF link

-Mark

Macanudist · #6 11-08-2003, 03:07 AM

Since I am not the "lawyer type," legal issues have always been like a plate of spaghetti to me! Court rulings at one level affecting laws at other levels are particularly confusing. It "seems" to me that they are appealing the way due process was or was not followed in the Florida courts. Are they actually appealing the whole topfree issue? The way I read it the federal court should rule that the Florida court did not follow procedure and would then kick it back to the state. All you lawyers chime in on this and clear up the issue...

Naturist Mark · #7 11-08-2003, 04:47 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Macanudist:
[qb]Are they actually appealing the whole topfree issue? The way I read it the federal court should rule that the Florida court did not follow procedure and would then kick it back to the state. All you lawyers chime in on this and clear up the issue... [/qb]

"Appeal" is the wrong word. This federal lawsuit is not an appeal, it is an entirely new case being brought against Brevard County, Florida on grounds that the application and enforcement of local laws against topfreedom for women violate Federal law. If they prevail there is no court for it to be 'kicked back' to.

Of course, once there is a verdict one side or the other is likely to appeal this case.

-Mark