"Boat People"

[Pieguy]

Maybe the Aussie government should stop being so hard on "Vietnamese Boat People", as Anglo-Saxons are the original boat people...

200 years ago, the First Fleet came to Australia:

on leaky, crappy, overcrowded boats

• without asking permission
  
• from a country that did not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from locals who wanted them out
  
  Today, refugees are coming to Australia:
  
  on leaky, crappy overcrowded fishing boats
  
  • without asking permission
    
  • from countries that do not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from the Federal Government who wants them out
    
    Sound familiar?

[Pieguy]

Maybe the Aussie government should stop being so hard on "Vietnamese Boat People", as Anglo-Saxons are the original boat people...

200 years ago, the First Fleet came to Australia:

on leaky, crappy, overcrowded boats

• without asking permission
  
• from a country that did not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from locals who wanted them out
  
  Today, refugees are coming to Australia:
  
  on leaky, crappy overcrowded fishing boats
  
  • without asking permission
    
  • from countries that do not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from the Federal Government who wants them out
    
    Sound familiar?

[KetchumMaine]

quote:

Originally posted by Pieguy:
Maybe the Aussie government should stop being so hard on "Vietnamese Boat People", as Anglo-Saxons are the original boat people...

200 years ago, the First Fleet came to Australia:

on leaky, crappy, overcrowded boats

• without asking permission
  
• from a country that did not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from locals who wanted them out
  
  Today, refugees are coming to Australia:
  
  on leaky, crappy overcrowded fishing boats
  
  • without asking permission
    
  • from countries that do not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from the Federal Government who wants them out
    
    Sound familiar?

Pie,
The difference is that 200 years ago, there were actual opportunities for refugees to support themselves. Nowadays, they rely on government programs and cause additional burdons on public services without contributing to the tax base. Here in the U.S., we have millions of people living on government handouts. Add to that all of the refugees and illegal immigrants, and we end up supporting quite a few people with our tax money. Add to that the fact that our government "loans" money to the Italian government to pay for their universal health care program, among other things, and you cna see that we pay quite a bit for taxes. Therefore, we don't need to be spending any more.

[SunGod]

If these people spent half the effort on improving their own countries as in getting out of them and into ours they wouldnt need to come at all. Call me an a-hole, but I live in S. Florida and we are being over run by every S. American/carribean dialect in existence. Question: Where do the American/Austrailian/W. European people go when enough immigrants come and eventually ruin the land, economy, culture, & government like they did their own? I say, send the boats back. All of them.

[usmc1]

quote:

Originally posted by SunGod:
If these people spent half the effort on improving their own countries as in getting out of them and into ours they wouldnt need to come at all. Call me an a-hole, but I live in S. Florida and we are being over run by every S. American/carribean dialect in existence. Question: Where do the American/Austrailian/W. European people go when enough immigrants come and eventually ruin the land, economy, culture, & government like they did their own? I say, send the boats back. All of them.

You're not only what you named yourself, you're also a misinformed reactionary.

Unless you're one of a dozen or so Indian Tribes of Florida, from Acuera, to Yustaga, your recent ancestors came from somewhere else to America seeking opportunity, a better life, religious freedom or were transported for stealing the king's bee's wax.

That gives you no right to characterize other more recent arrivals in such a reprehensibly racist, demeaning and zenophobic way.

Those Caribs and South Americans you speak of so disparagingly along with Spaniards were inhabiting and visiting Florida a long before you and yours showed up on the scene.

The wisest thing you wrote was when you asked to be called taht which you so obviously are.

[usmc1]

quote:

Originally posted by KetchumMaine:

quote:

Originally posted by Pieguy:
Maybe the Aussie government should stop being so hard on "Vietnamese Boat People", as Anglo-Saxons are the original boat people...

200 years ago, the First Fleet came to Australia:

on leaky, crappy, overcrowded boats

• without asking permission
  
• from a country that did not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from locals who wanted them out
  
  Today, refugees are coming to Australia:
  
  on leaky, crappy overcrowded fishing boats
  
  • without asking permission
    
  • from countries that do not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from the Federal Government who wants them out
    
    Sound familiar?

Pie,
The difference is that 200 years ago, there were actual opportunities for refugees to support themselves. Nowadays, they rely on government programs and cause additional burdons on public services without contributing to the tax base. Here in the U.S., we have millions of people living on government handouts. Add to that all of the refugees and illegal immigrants, and we end up supporting quite a few people with our tax money. Add to that the fact that our government "loans" money to the Italian government to pay for their universal health care program, among other things, and you cna see that we pay quite a bit for taxes. Therefore, we don't need to be spending any more.

Gag on gnats and swallow camels. $20,000 per American on Average spent on death and destruction in Iraq and nary a peep about wasted tax money.

A pittance on education and health care for migrant workers and people trying to secure the blessings of liberty and you're outraged.

I thought you were going to eschew controversy? Old habits are hard to break aren't they.

[SunGod]

I'm not misinformed, I live here in S. Florida and I see this disaster unfold everyday. I these arrogant immigrants come here and DEMAND school books in spanish, DEMAND public signs in spanish, DEMAND free healthcare, DEMAND housing, DEMAND DEMAND DEMAND. What do we as "native" Americans and actual "citizens" get from this? I say nothing but ghettos, crime (latino gangs popping up all over s. Florida), poverty, increase burden on tax payers, well fare, healthcare companies, and a dilution of OUR culture. White and black. Its not really a racial issue, its a cultural AMERICAN issue. You call me a racists, but where does it say that White and Black Americans have to roll over for the brown invasion and just take it?!? Its not racism to say this. I am not anti any race, I am as for any other culture as my own and they all have a place. I just do not accept that I as a white American must sit back and watch my culture/language be roled over by arrogant immigrants who think America owes them something. I would think that being in Texas, you of all people can see this!?!?

[Boreas]

quote:

You're not only what you named yourself, you're also a misinformed reactionary.

Unless you're one of a dozen or so Indian Tribes of Florida, from Acuera, to Yustaga, your recent ancestors came from somewhere else to America seeking opportunity, a better life, religious freedom or were transported for stealing the king's bee's wax.

That gives you no right to characterize other more recent arrivals in such a reprehensibly racist, demeaning and zenophobic way.

Those Caribs and South Americans you speak of so disparagingly along with Spaniards were inhabiting and visiting Florida a long before you and yours showed up on the scene.

The wisest thing you wrote was when you asked to be called taht which you so obviously are.

I would like to second what you have written usmc1. Articulate as always.

Of course there are SOME refugees who use the system.....just as there are SOME folks born in North America who do. Many or most are actually contributing well to their new country and want to live "the American Dream" (is that a real thing?) In my town, there are many new immigrants from Africa (Sudan mostly) and they are hardworking, productive citizens....a welcome addition. I used to live in Toronto and would say the same about people I met there who were new to Canada.

Perhaps the social problems you see SunGod are as a result of a government who would rather wage war than develop healthier countries and societies.....espcially its own.

We are all descendents of refugees unless we are full-blooded Cree, Iroquois or Mowhawk and their brothers/sisters.

[sw1sweendog]

try living on the southern boarder and see if you feel the same.gonna have to go with sun god on this one.i feel like a foreiner in my own country.

[KetchumMaine]

quote:

Originally posted by usmc1:

quote:

Originally posted by KetchumMaine:

quote:

Originally posted by Pieguy:
Maybe the Aussie government should stop being so hard on "Vietnamese Boat People", as Anglo-Saxons are the original boat people...

200 years ago, the First Fleet came to Australia:

on leaky, crappy, overcrowded boats

• without asking permission
  
• from a country that did not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from locals who wanted them out
  
  Today, refugees are coming to Australia:
  
  on leaky, crappy overcrowded fishing boats
  
  • without asking permission
    
  • from countries that do not want them[/list]meeting with hostility from the Federal Government who wants them out
    
    Sound familiar?

Pie,
The difference is that 200 years ago, there were actual opportunities for refugees to support themselves. Nowadays, they rely on government programs and cause additional burdons on public services without contributing to the tax base. Here in the U.S., we have millions of people living on government handouts. Add to that all of the refugees and illegal immigrants, and we end up supporting quite a few people with our tax money. Add to that the fact that our government "loans" money to the Italian government to pay for their universal health care program, among other things, and you cna see that we pay quite a bit for taxes. Therefore, we don't need to be spending any more.

Gag on gnats and swallow camels. $20,000 per American on Average spent on death and destruction in Iraq and nary a peep about wasted tax money.

A pittance on education and health care for migrant workers and people trying to secure the blessings of liberty and you're outraged.

I thought you were going to eschew controversy? Old habits are hard to break aren't they.

I was expressing my opinion. I decided not to continue a previous argument with you. YOU decided to make a controversy of this topic.
Obviously, you are out looking for an argument. You also appear to be a person who refuses to accept when they are wrong. Because of that, I refuse to respond to any more of your postings on this topic.

[KetchumMaine]

quote:

Originally posted by SunGod:
If these people spent half the effort on improving their own countries as in getting out of them and into ours they wouldnt need to come at all. Call me an a-hole, but I live in S. Florida and we are being over run by every S. American/carribean dialect in existence. Question: Where do the American/Austrailian/W. European people go when enough immigrants come and eventually ruin the land, economy, culture, & government like they did their own? I say, send the boats back. All of them.

Sungod,
In many of the countries from which these people flee, there are political forces which prevent them from making a decent living. They are forced to live in sub-standard housing and eat sub-standard food. The children attend sub-standard schools and are looked down upon based upon social status.

For some strange reason, they think it is different here in America, but it isn't. The reason it isn't is because our government overspends and gives away too much money. The lower class remains poor while the politicians and other rich people get richer. The only difference between the other countries and ours is that our government has a better marketing strategy. They actually let us believe that we have a say in how our country works. But the politicians have it sewn up. That is why there are only two major political parties and we still operate gas powered automobiles. They control everything. We are just mice in a cage watched by the mad scientists (in Washington)for their amusement.

[KetchumMaine]

quote:

Originally posted by Still_Boreas:

quote:

You're not only what you named yourself, you're also a misinformed reactionary.

Unless you're one of a dozen or so Indian Tribes of Florida, from Acuera, to Yustaga, your recent ancestors came from somewhere else to America seeking opportunity, a better life, religious freedom or were transported for stealing the king's bee's wax.

That gives you no right to characterize other more recent arrivals in such a reprehensibly racist, demeaning and zenophobic way.

Those Caribs and South Americans you speak of so disparagingly along with Spaniards were inhabiting and visiting Florida a long before you and yours showed up on the scene.

The wisest thing you wrote was when you asked to be called taht which you so obviously are.

I would like to second what you have written usmc1. Articulate as always.

Of course there are SOME refugees who use the system.....just as there are SOME folks born in North America who do. Many or most are actually contributing well to their new country and want to live "the American Dream" (is that a real thing?) In my town, there are many new immigrants from Africa (Sudan mostly) and they are hardworking, productive citizens....a welcome addition. I used to live in Toronto and would say the same about people I met there who were new to Canada.

Perhaps the social problems you see SunGod are as a result of a government who would rather wage war than develop healthier countries and societies.....espcially its own.

We are all descendents of refugees unless we are full-blooded Cree, Iroquois or Mowhawk and their brothers/sisters.

That is my point, We need to stop spending money trying to make the world a democracy and start taking care of business at home. If we had full employment, a stable economy and reasonable taxes, I wouldn't care how many people crossed the border (legally) to become citizens.

[KetchumMaine]

Pieguy,
Is this what you expected when you started this thread?? Washington D.C. starts wars in a similar fashion. Don't feel bad, it was bound to happen anyway. Some people just tend to gravitate to certain subjects.

[Pieguy]

Not at all, I'm delighted to have started such a spirited political debate. By all means continue.

[alfredr]

I wish I had the time or could think and type fast enough to respond properly to this topic. I'll do what I can.
Most people come for the opportunity here or where ever. They don't come for the welfare system. They don't come to join gangs. They come to improve their life and the lives of their children even if they can't bring their children here because we make it so difficult to enter this country legally. Yes. they do want their children to be able to get an education if they are here.
And they are willing to work hard here to make their dreams come true. This country has always relied on immigrant (cheap) labor to build this economy. They do the dirty and the physically hard jobs that are so necessary but unglamorous and don't attract people who are already comfortable in their situation.
This is still a land of opportunity, even if the streets aren't paved with gold.
Our economy has always been built on the backs of immigrants, only now we aren't letting them come legally, so they come anyway.
And by the way, you ain't seen poor until you have seen a third world slum.