Politics and the attacks of London

[Eric6420]

As sad as the attacks of London are, I think that we should not forget the causes of terrorism.

A lot of people think that the war in Irak was about cheap oil for the USA. Obviously, that did not worked.

Let's face it. Al Quaida is more popular than Bush or Blair in most muslim countries (1,3 billion persons). There are reasons for such impopularity.

Maybe we should ask ourselves why so much people in the world, particularly in the muslim world, hate so much the USA (and its supporters like England).

The US media is not exactly showing what the horrors the US army has done in Irak, but the muslim world know it and saw it in tv networks like Al Jaazira.

Most Americans did not see the Ikakis children with severe malformations because the depleted uranium the us army has spread in the air of Irak. Thousands of innocent Irakis have been killed in this war, including children, women and old people.

I guess that if you were an Iraki, you would not like Americans very much.

Support for Al Quaida in muslim countries would be very weak if it was not for the war against Irak.

China has a better image in the world than the USA.

I am sure that the war in Irak was a big mistake.

[Eric6420]

As sad as the attacks of London are, I think that we should not forget the causes of terrorism.

A lot of people think that the war in Irak was about cheap oil for the USA. Obviously, that did not worked.

Let's face it. Al Quaida is more popular than Bush or Blair in most muslim countries (1,3 billion persons). There are reasons for such impopularity.

Maybe we should ask ourselves why so much people in the world, particularly in the muslim world, hate so much the USA (and its supporters like England).

The US media is not exactly showing what the horrors the US army has done in Irak, but the muslim world know it and saw it in tv networks like Al Jaazira.

Most Americans did not see the Ikakis children with severe malformations because the depleted uranium the us army has spread in the air of Irak. Thousands of innocent Irakis have been killed in this war, including children, women and old people.

I guess that if you were an Iraki, you would not like Americans very much.

Support for Al Quaida in muslim countries would be very weak if it was not for the war against Irak.

China has a better image in the world than the USA.

I am sure that the war in Irak was a big mistake.

[Qikdraw]

quote:

Originally posted by Eric6420:
I guess that if you were an Iraki, you would not like Americans very much.

Just a quick point here. Most people who dislike the US do not dislike Americans. They see a difference between the people of the US, and the US's foriegn policy.

I disagree with a blanket statement that says they hate Americans. Its just far too simplistic.

Qikdraw

[Swimguy]

The hatred of freedom-loving countries and today's attacks has nothing to do with the war in Iraq, even though many will say it does. The hatred has been brewing for years, think of the many attacks in Europe from the 80's on. This attack coincides with the summit in Great Britain. Canada is a part of that summit, and let's all pray your country--along with all other countries--is safe from additional terrorist attacks.

[mayfree1]

Eric,

Your view of the world is extremely simplistic and naive. Why do you believe a few overly religious extremist muslums despise the US? The reason is they are indoctrinated into this mindset as children. The believe that suicide will bring them paradise. This is totally sick. The US is just a country like your own. Please refain from making silly judgments which are not base in reality. The war in Iraq is a symptom, not a cause for hatred. The US is the most powerful country on earth at the present time and you can not expect this power to be kept in check if challenged.

[KirkOntario]

quote:

Originally posted by Eric6420:
As sad as the attacks of London are, I think that we should not forget the causes of terrorism.

A lot of people think that the war in Irak was about cheap oil for the USA. Obviously, that did not worked.

Let's face it. Al Quaida is more popular than Bush or Blair in most muslim countries (1,3 billion persons). There are reasons for such impopularity.

Maybe we should ask ourselves why so much people in the world, particularly in the muslim world, hate so much the USA (and its supporters like England).

The US media is not exactly showing what the horrors the US army has done in Irak, but the muslim world know it and saw it in tv networks like Al Jaazira.

Most Americans did not see the Ikakis children with severe malformations because the depleted uranium the us army has spread in the air of Irak. Thousands of innocent Irakis have been killed in this war, including children, women and old people.

I guess that if you were an Iraki, you would not like Americans very much.

Support for Al Quaida in muslim countries would be very weak if it was not for the war against Irak.

China has a better image in the world than the USA.

I am sure that the war in Irak was a big mistake.

I predict we will not find the bombers in London are Iraqis as we did find they were in Madrid. It will be the usual assortment of Morrocans, Egyptians, Saudi's, and Westernized Muslims who hate the West but choose to raise their women and children there because it is better and safer.

[KirkOntario]

quote:

Originally posted by mayfree1:
Eric,

Your view of the world is extremely simplistic and naive. Why do you believe a few overly religious extremist muslums despise the US? The reason is they are indoctrinated into this mindset as children. The believe that suicide will bring them paradise. This is totally sick. The US is just a country like your own. Please refain from making silly judgments which are not base in reality. The war in Iraq is a symptom, not a cause for hatred. The US is the most powerful country on earth at the present time and you can not expect this power to be kept in check if challenged.

On that note Canada was named by Osama Bin Laden as a target for attacks on terrorist documents found in Afghanistan. We are not safe which is why we fight this evil worldwide.

The Left has too long downplayed the threat, called it a 'mindset' and isolated incident. Do they dare now declare that the gates of Guantanamo Bay be opened? They will get back to it later..but not now.

[Trailscout]

Our only hope is to declare the USA as an Islamic Republic, institute Sharia law and begin beheading infidels and start beating our women.

But should we be a Sunni or Shiite Islamic republic? Oh, no! We are still doomed to an eternity of carbombing and death squads by the enemies of either sect.

[gamblefish]

Stop! Stop right there! This is the grammar police!!!

This thread may be politically correct, butt the title is not grammatically correct.

It should have been: "Politics and the attacks on London"

Attacks of London would be more like London attacking something, or maybe a disease called "London" attacking people or maybe someone who starts uncontrollably talking with a british accent like, "Oh, bloody hell, I feel an attack of London comin' on!! Blimey!!".

Anyway, carry on discussing your politics ad nauseum...

[NudeAl]

I have a visceral reaction to these attacks. Perhaps they just brought back too many feelings from 9-11 and the fight to Baghdad. I am a Marine I expect to be in another fight someday. As such I consider myself a valid military target. I would even put the police and various other civil authorities in the same category. These terrorists do not make any such distinction between military targets and civilians. No warnings were given as even the bloody, radical, Provisional IRA did when they bombed London. The Islamic terrorists simply have no regard for human life or anything else except there own narrow agenda. This is a war not limited to Iraq or Afghanistan. It is a war on all of civilization, at least western civilization. It will go on indefinatly until we have defeated these terrorists.

The middle east has been at war in one way or another since the end of WWII and the creation of the state of Israel. I'm sure it will continue at least that much longer. The difference is now they have broadened their war to include the rest of the world. There can be no excuse for what they did or other similar acts. It is barbaric, gruesome, murder of non-combatants by an enemy that has no use for our laws of warfare. They will continue doing this until they have won or been defeated simple as that. Even if you submit to their blackmail the you are not safe because at anytime they may decide to remind you of the power they hold over you.

My point is this event should serve as a reminder that we are in a war that has no borders and by one side at least no rules. We need to remember sometimes that we are not the bad guys. It is ridiculous to say we deserved this or this was done because this. It is because of a few narrow minded religious zealots have indoctrinated their followers in the false belief that this is a holy war. A war against the modern crusader. This is absurd as much as I wish it were we have to behave and act according to the rules of warfare.

As terrible as the current situation is in Iraq I would rather continue to fight there rather than having even more of these terrorists loose in other parts of the world. I know someone will say this is flawed logic but Iraq is a magnet for every I hate America terrorist in the world and as long as they continue to flock there we can continue to kill them there.

[KirkOntario]

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines05/0514-05.htm

Think this 'brilliant' film-maker would get his standing 'o' today at cannes by the sushi eating set?

[jon71]

There is some truth in what KirkOntario says but just to a point. Yes they hated us to start with (western world) but an unjust and poorly conducted war in Iraq certainly threw gas on a fire.

[KirkOntario]

Let's all take comfort in the words of that great American patriot, Michael Moore:

"There is no terrorist threat".

[NudeAl]

quote:

There is some truth in what KirkOntario says but just to a point. Yes they hated us to start with (western world) but an unjust and poorly conducted war in Iraq certainly threw gas on a fire.

I think I'll have to take issue with that statement. The conventional war was as lopsided a victory as anyone has ever had. Unfortunatly the civilian government would not listen to the military leaders who said in order to carry on stability and sustainment operations they would need double the number of personnel. Military occupations of a conquered nation last a long time, just look at Germany and Japan. Guerrilla warfare has traditionally been one of the most difficult and bloody types of wars this one is no exception. It will go on until the Iraqis have decided to take a stand one way or another. It could still degenerate into a civil war, if it did it would be Beiriut all over again only bloodier.

[Sailor]

I agree with what Nude Al has been saying.

When judging the extremist Islamic terrorists, you have to try not to picture them as following the same logic that you do. Because they don't.

As time goes on, they say that they are doing what they are doing to get back for some action, but this action that needs revenge is always changing. I remember back to when Osama Bin Laden said that his fight was against the American presence in his homeland, Saudi Arabia. That didn't work very well, because he could not rally enough support from the leadership, or the people. So he needed to find more popular issues to continue doing his thing.

Israel was an easy target, because, even though it is very small compared to its Arab neighbors, it was still quite irritating to have a modern democracy in their midst. A series of conventional wars did not seem to get rid of this irritant, so terrorism was a natural choice. (and the aftermath of the wars left some unnatural situations which are easy to find fault with)

The truth is that they (the extremists) feel that Islam should be spread all over the world, and the Sharia law should be in place everywhere. (talk about top-free for women, that would be the end of face-free!) And anyone who does not agree to an Islamic world should die. The excuse of the moment is meaningless. Any exposure to the western world, which is impossible to avoid these days with modern communications, is liable to be an excuse for attack. But its not the core reason.

So the choice is to either accept that fate, or defeat these modern-day Crusaders.