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  • Cellphone cameras in locker rooms

    I read a newspaper report this morning that says that cellphones with integrated cameras are being used to photo people who are nude in locker rooms. The photos are then uploaded to the Internet.

    It all started with security cameras. If you are outdoors in an urban area, you may be under surveillance. Now, if you are in a locker room, you may be under surveillance.

    Most people will be freaked out by this, but I, as a nudist, would not. Because of my involvement in nudism, I am not ashamed of my body, and don't feel the need to hide it from the world.

    I don't like the loss of privacy that results from surveillance and, now, cellphone cameras. But, recognizing that this loss is permanent, I'll have to adapt, and the adaption will be easier for me than for non-nudists.

    As an analogy, if and when devices become available that can identify when people are lying, the easiest way to adapt will be to always tell the truth.

    Now that everyone may be under scrutiny from personal cameras, the easiest way to adapt will be not to be concerned about being photographed.

    If you see a nude, honest person, that'll be me.

    Gary

  • #2
    I read a newspaper report this morning that says that cellphones with integrated cameras are being used to photo people who are nude in locker rooms. The photos are then uploaded to the Internet.

    It all started with security cameras. If you are outdoors in an urban area, you may be under surveillance. Now, if you are in a locker room, you may be under surveillance.

    Most people will be freaked out by this, but I, as a nudist, would not. Because of my involvement in nudism, I am not ashamed of my body, and don't feel the need to hide it from the world.

    I don't like the loss of privacy that results from surveillance and, now, cellphone cameras. But, recognizing that this loss is permanent, I'll have to adapt, and the adaption will be easier for me than for non-nudists.

    As an analogy, if and when devices become available that can identify when people are lying, the easiest way to adapt will be to always tell the truth.

    Now that everyone may be under scrutiny from personal cameras, the easiest way to adapt will be not to be concerned about being photographed.

    If you see a nude, honest person, that'll be me.

    Gary

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    • #3
      I am also not going to let the cell phone cameras win by covering up in the locker room. If I get photographed changing so be it. I am also not going to be ashamed of who and what I am.

      Comment


      • #4
        I agree with you guys. It may not be in order, or very polite, but I feel I have nothing to be ashamed of, and am not doing anything wrong!

        Actually I've long stopped worrying about being photographed without my permission.
        A couple of yrs ago at Blacks Beach, a couple of tourists actually video taped me, as I was walking naked to the water!? I was going to speak to them, but then thought what's the point!

        I've also been photographed at Orient Beach, despite security guards being around.

        I think it would be totally different if you were behaving inappropriately in a nude setting, and you were photographed. Serves you right!!

        Comment


        • #5
          Here is my stand on cameras being used more freely...

          If I have something to really hide other than a gift for that special someone for a special occasion, I shouldn't be doing it in the first place.

          In addition, we as citizens have a lot to be thankful for with these devices. In some areas...they are of great use in detering crime that has been allowed to go on way to long...such as prostitution and drug deals...so if that is what it is gonna take to make my community safer, I welcome them even more so, after all with all the budget cuts in so many communities, if this helps...go for it [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

          Regarding locker rooms...there is always gonna be at least one bad apple somewhere [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif[/img]

          Greensunshine in the Pacific NW [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

          Comment


          • #6
            When cameras were first put on cell phones I told my wife that there would be trouble...and sure enough, there has been. While I'm not ashamed of my body, I do mind someone sneaking into a place where I am naked or not, and taking my picture without my permission. That is an invasion of privacy, and to my knowledge, privacy is still protected under the constitution! I would definitely feel that way even more so if my CHILDREN were photographed at our resort! Pedophilia is a huge problem in America, and these cameras are just the thing pedophiles want to capture pictures of their young prey, or to sell to other pedos over the internet. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif[/img]

            Comment


            • #7
              I am surprise at some of you who think it is ok for someone to bring a camera in room and take pictures of ppl w/o permission to post on internet. You actually don't have a problem with that? even if it was done to you?

              To do such thing is wrong unethical. People in locker room have a right to their privacy and a right to disrobe or shower w/o fearing someone has a camera and is taking pictures. It has NOTHINNG to do with body shame, nudism, loving your body or hating it. It has everything to do with right or privacy and consent.

              Do you know how many women that are violated daily b/c pics r being taken of them w/o their knowledge. Such thing as this is a violation of privacy and can leave someone very emotionally damage.

              Do you know the lives and careers that can be ruinend for stupid stuff like this. I will be attending law school next fall and if some pictures like that were posted online, that could be end of my career as someeone can report me to the BAR.

              Whether you are comfortable w/ your body or not, having something like that done w/o your consent can do a lot of harm

              Comment


              • #8
                I definitely have to strongly side with TXK NUDE and Croydon on this issue. Surveillance cameras in public places don't bother me but having anybody that wants to to be able to take pictures in very private areas do. Although I'm not ashamed of my body, I do not want my picture taken with out my permission and uploaded on the internet. Grennsunshine mentioned about there always being one bad apple out there somewheres. Kids are not always bad apples but they are immature and don't think about ramifications of their actions. Think about that for awhile. Then, as has been mentioned, there are lots of paedophiles out there whose ability to exploit our children have been made alot eaiser.
                This issue has nothing at all to do with body acceptance. It has everything to do with invasion of privacy. The way some of you talk, you would seem to have no problem with Joe Blow or whoever coming in off the street into your home and taking pictures of you in the bath, bedroom or where ever. Afterall, if you are proud of your body and doing nothing wrong...

                Comment


                • #9
                  I agree with Croydon (except the part about fretting about the BAR. Why would the BAR care about just changing in a locker room?). Except for a 'face in the crowd' type of shot, I wouldn't want MY picture, clothed or not, put on the internet unless it was by MY own choice. I feel taking this choice away from any individual is an invasion of privacy.

                  OTOH, I have no problem with surveillance cameras as long as the images are retained only when wrongdoing actually occurs.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I don't buy the argument that people who want privacy can be presumed to be doing something that is wrong and needs to be exposed and posted on the Internet.

                    Nor do I believe that if you are in a public setting, that gives the photographer the right to sell a recognizeable image of you to whomever wants to buy your image without your permission and without compensation. There are already laws on the books against such behavior.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      quote:
                      Originally posted by greensunshine:
                      [qb] Here is my stand on cameras being used more freely...

                      If I have something to really hide ... I shouldn't be doing it in the first place.
                      [/qb]
                      If you are agreeing to accept surveillance anywhere, anytime, there is a danger that you will lose the right to decide on your own actions. Big Brother is watching you, and he may have different views on what is appropriate behavior, and may impose them on you.

                      Gary

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        When Hill Country Nudist had their annual boat trip to Hippy Hollow, everyone had to choose what color wrist band they wanted - Green, anyone could take a picture of you whenever they wanted, Yellow - ask before taking any pictures and Red, no pictures. I only saw one person on the boat with a Red band, maybe 25% had Yellow and the rest were all Green.
                        Based on this very small and not statistically valid sample, you could say that about 75% of nudist do not care if they are photographed or not. However, in my opinion, unless permission has been expressly given (i.e.- like the Green wrist band), a person should always be asked first.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          quote:
                          I don't buy the argument that people who want privacy can be presumed to be doing something that is wrong and needs to be exposed and posted on the Internet.
                          I agree with you here. If you assume the government is an entirely benevolent entity and that people will not care about your private behavior and that honest information won't be used dishonestly, then privacy is irrelevent. We must remember that surveylance is NEVER a two way street, most of the time you never know to what purpose it is being put. Even "harmless" surveylance for public safety purposes could as easily be used for nefarious purposes.

                          Government is not benevolent and may act to promote or obstruct lifestyles or points of view. Durng the 50s, 60s and 70s, the civil rights and antiwar movements were heavily surveyled with an eye to creating "enemies" lists and seeking out scandals whith which to discredit activists. Thousands of people were marked for immediate pickup in the event of a political or military crisis.

                          People who find out you are something they don't like may seek to destroy you. There's a reason so many people live in the closet about diffrent aspect of their lives. Being outed can lead to loss of their livelihood, their children and even, in extreme caes, their lives.

                          Imagine Joe McCarthy with modern technology at this disposal. Imagine Hitler. Imagine Hoover or Nixon effortlessly compiling dossiers on political enemies and competing politicians that took hundreds of man-hours of skilled labor back then.

                          Hasn't anyone read or seen Orwell's 1984?

                          Even if they aren't "outed" they may find themselves denied promotion, employment or even the subject of annonymous abuse and they may NEVER know what or who or why. The puritan boss who sees that nude photo of you on the internet can easily nix your future at his firm and any you might transfer to, without your knowledge. The sexual predator boss can as easily decide your picture means you are an easy target. The Social worker who sees it could decide you are a threat to your children. And on and on.... [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif[/img]

                          Dsn't have to be nudism. It could be ANY trait someone, somewhere doesn't like and it could be used without your knowledge and without any opportunity to respond.

                          Not to mention businesses using surveylance to get a competitive edge. Or common criminals; blackmailers, identity theives, sexual predators, kidnappers. I've met people on bulletin boards I wouldn't want to know my identity or whereabouts. How would you feel about somebody tracking your 12 y.o. child?

                          Let me suggest to people who don't value their privacy that they post a copy of their driver's licence on the web along with their social security number and see what happens.

                          We need privacy because there are evil people who will put honest information to evil ends.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            It is unethical, but it's important to remember a few things. The pictures (at least currently) will turn out kind of crapy. Also, nobody will blame anyone for being that kind of victim. We all live in the same society and hopefully would be smart and understanding enough to see the difference between voluntary and involutnary nude photography. Case in point, I don't think you will get dis-bared or kicked out of law school for something which you had no control over and was legal. If you do, you can always go to court [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif[/img]

                            Fresh Air

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                            • #15
                              quote:
                              Nor do I believe that if you are in a public setting, that gives the photographer the right to sell a recognizeable image of you to whomever wants to buy your image without your permission and without compensation. There are already laws on the books against such behavior.
                              No laws like that in the US to my knowledge. While your image may not be used for commercial purposes without your permission, it can be used for journalistic purposes. Once you are in a public setting you may just end up on the front page of the newspaper with nothing to say about it.

                              Another loophole is that photos that are taken and not used for commercial purposes nor used for journalistic purposes, but rather distributed freely on the net are STILL treated like journalistic photos.

                              It is illegal to take photos without permission where there is a reasonable expectation of privacy. That includes private residences, locker rooms, changing rooms, rest rooms, private clubs and any business where there is a "no cameras" rule.

                              Leave your living room curtain open and you've lost that "reasonable expectation". You now fall under the "public" rules for use. Ditto if you knew the camera was there and allowed it to be used. Unless you have an enforcable promise otherwise, you've just gone public.

                              It's a rough world out there, as Paris Hilton just found out.

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