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  • #46
    quote:
    He has repeatedly offended and repeatedly defied authority and made it perfectly clear that he intends to continue. What are the authorities supposed to do?

    Change the Law. Make public nudity legal. Allow people to dress (or not) the way they want. Teach the public that their parents were Wrong about nudity. Accept other views. Learn to tollerate differences.

    Allow Freedom to grow.

    You have nothing to Fear , but Fear itself.

    Steve

    Comment


    • #47
      quote:
      Originally posted by Trailscout:
      [qb] Is there any way of peeking underneath Rocket's IP address and seeing if Rocket is a boy or a girl. I kinda wondered about that. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img] [/qb]
      I'm pretty certain he is a young guy. No young woman living in modern Canada would be unfamiliar with how a tampon is worn (he suggested in one post that clothes were needed to 'hold' them in place).

      When Rocket comes back (by whatever name), let's hope he will take a new tact. If that happens we need to welcome it. Different points of view are good, discussing them respectfully makes all sides better understand not only other viewpoints, but their own as well. I value Stu's thoughtful contributions, even when in disagreement.

      -Mark

      Comment


      • #48
        Mark,
        Did you ever see that movie "Carrie"?
        I hope Rocket doesn't have the power of telekenesis! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif[/img]

        When he/she comes back, I will give him/her a second chance. Dispite all the putdowns, I have a feeling he/she is listening to us a lot more than he/she is admitting.

        Comment


        • #49
          Steve

          "Change the Law. Make public nudity legal. Allow people to dress (or not) the way they want. Teach the public that their parents were Wrong about nudity. Accept other views. Learn to tollerate differences."

          My parents weren't wrong. In fact, they didn't particularly teach me that nudity was something wrong or sinful. And I'm perfectly able to tolerate differences betwen people. But when you are in the public domain you have a duty to behave in such a way that most people find acceptable - you respect the fact that it's everybody's environment and everybody has the use these places and, when there, they have a right to be comfortable. That has to mean that some people's preferences about not wearing clothes has to be confined to private places or places set aside expressly for that purpose.

          Your suggestion would bring utopia for those naturists who want that; it would bring hell on earth for those of us who find public nudity offensive.

          What a great compromise..NOT!!!

          naturistmark1

          It's a shame about Rocket - and right now I'm feeling a bit isolated here again. I didn't agree with everything she said, nor the way it was said, but it was nice to have someone else here who shares my concerns about public nudity. I think she was intelligent and her intentions were good.

          I respect the judgement of the administrators here. They must have a hard job keeping everyone happy and I appreciate the fact that I'm still allowed to post here a whole year after my first contraversial contribution.

          It might surprise you to learn that, in spite of my profound and deep-seated opposition to PUBLIC nudity, when in conversation with others about naturism, I express an enormous amount of respect and admiration for naturists as a group.

          Trailscout

          "When he/she comes back, I will give him/her a second chance. Dispite all the putdowns, I have a feeling he/she is listening to us a lot more than he/she is admitting."

          I think she'll be back. Or at least I hope she will.

          Stu

          Comment


          • #50
            quote:
            Originally posted by stu2630:
            [qb]It's a shame about Rocket - and right now I'm feeling a bit isolated here again. [/qb]
            Hey, you've got us nuddies haven't you?
            quote:
            [qb] I think she was intelligent and her intentions were good.[/qb]
            Well it depends what you mean by intelligent but I don't believe she was a naturist as she claimed - she used the word 'naturalist' three times which is a mistake only non-naturists make. She also claimed to be at university but her use of grammar and punctuation was, in my opinion, a bit too eccentric for a university level student.

            Telling lies doesn't make her intentions look too good.

            Rik

            Comment


            • #51
              According to this report Steve Gough was found guilty of "walking naked in the presence of the public in circumstances likely to produce a road safety hazard ".

              So now nudity is a road safety issue. Whatever next?

              [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img] Rik

              Comment


              • #52
                quote:
                Originally posted by Rik:
                [qb] So now nudity is a road safety issue. Whatever next?[/qb]
                Of course! It really has nothing to do with nudity, just safety.

                The distracting sight of a nude pedestrian just happens to cause a dangerous inattention to safe driving.

                But it is the 'distraction' that is the issue, not the nudity.

                That is why constables all over the UK are also rounding up people sporting bad haircuts, hip-hop baggy trousers, and golfing outfits.

                -Mark

                Comment


                • #53
                  When I was in England from 67-69, I went to London one day. As I walked across the street in London, I saw a gorgeous young gal in a mini-skirt that was flopping up and down (the mimi-skirt, not her) as she ran across the street. I just stood and stared. Car tires were squeeling as men slammed on their brakes to get a better look. So she was a safety hazard, and she was dressed. By the way, she wasn't wearing any underwear.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Nude in the North said:
                    Make public nudity legal. Allow people to dress (or not) the way they want. Teach the public that their parents were Wrong about nudity. Accept other views. Learn to tollerate differences.

                    "Your suggestion would bring utopia for those naturists who want that; it would bring hell on earth for those of us who find public nudity offensive."

                    stu, your hell on earth would last only until you were ready to accept it. It would also put the adult industry nearly out of business.

                    "I think she was intelligent and her intentions were good."

                    I don't know about her academic smarts, but her intentions did not seem to be good. She may have started off fine with the disagreement about the party where the host told someone that if he wanted to, he could undress. Her arguments there were fine, but she went downhill fast. While treating this as a debate, she refused to use any debating skills. She refused to even accept that she was wrong, or that it was even a possibility. I don't think she can learn from her mistakes.

                    "If a bunch of hardened convicts can put up with people like themselves (theives, burglars etc) but they find a man who walks about naked to be so offensive that he has to be protected from them, what does THAT say about the public attitude towards public nudity?"

                    Well, for one the source is in question. Inmates wouldn't treat him any differently than others, in my opinion. As far as I know, the only ones who need protection are the ones who harm children. However, the culture in prisons are very different than outside prison.

                    Bob S.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      quote:
                      Originally posted by Rik:
                      [qb] According to this report Steve Gough was found guilty of "walking naked in the presence of the public in circumstances likely to produce a road safety hazard ".

                      So now nudity is a road safety issue. Whatever next?

                      [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_confused.gif[/img] Rik [/qb]
                      In my opinion, any law that has the word "likely" in it is unreasonable. What does "likely" mean? To me, it means a 50% or greater probability.

                      How do you test whether a distraction is likely to constitute a road hazard. If the probability required is 50% or more, you can set up a distraction and see what happens when, say, 100 cars pass by. If 50% or more slow down, swerve or spin out, then you do have a "likely" distraction.

                      Common sense suggests that the probability of causing enough distraction to be labelled a road hazard is much less than 50%. Let's give some credit to drivers.

                      Actually, a bigger distraction is a police car stopped on the side of the road, with lights flashing, while the officer spends 10 minutes giving someone a ticket. Why aren't police officers charged?

                      Gary

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Mr Gough isn't especially a road safety hazard - he's just highly offensive.

                        I suspect that if there had been a law explicitly making nudity in public a criminal offence he wouldn't have been charged with this one.

                        If I were the judge I'd be considering imposing an Anisocial Behaviour Order on him that directed him not to remain in or re-enter Scotland - naked or otherwise. The judge has the power to do this now even following summary conviction. That way he could be detained if he failed to leave the country forthwith and charged with a serious offence of breaching an Order and that carries upto 5 years imprisonment! I wonder if he's considered that course of action. We'll see at the end of the month.

                        Stu

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Sorry, Stu.

                          Case Gough has just shown that public nudity is not illegal (so it is legal) in the UK. You don't have a properly applicable law to the case. Causing a road safety hazard is only a pretext.

                          I hope that the case will be sent to higher courts.

                          Kari P

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Kari - Mr Gough has been found GUILTY - the last occasion was for three matters, 1. breach of bail, 2, breach of the peace and 3. behaviour likely to distract drivers. All these offences directly relate to his nudity and nothing else. He was convicted in his home town earlier this year of a public order offence purely by virtue of him being nude in public. He tried to appeal that one but still stands convicted. He is still in prison and, by the time he is sentenced, will have bee incarcerated for almost 3 months!!

                            Now if you want to think public nudity is OK in England in the eyes of the law, then be my guest!! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

                            Stu

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              quote:
                              Originally posted by stu2630:
                              [qb] Now if you want to think public nudity is OK in England in the eyes of the law, then be my guest!! [/qb]
                              All this gives us hope that eventually the law will catch up with public opnion which, by and large, is ambivalent towards the "antics of Steve Gough" - except of course those members of the public which are in your immediate social circle and the worthy Mrs MacDonald (51) of Inverness [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

                              Rik

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                quote:
                                Originally posted by stu2630:
                                [qb]
                                Now if you want to think public nudity is OK in England in the eyes of the law, then be my guest!! [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif[/img]

                                Stu [/qb]
                                Obviously not all people in law enforcement are friendly to nudity. But the fact that nudity is not illegal per se suggests some ambivalence. Surely if public nudity were so offensive to the masses a simple unambiguous law would have been enacted? Instead a multitude of squishy 'public order' laws are used against some people, but not others.

                                My sense from what Stu has described is that Britain doesn't outlaw the activity, just the consequencial (and occasionally hypothetical) reaction to nudity. I.E. it is illegal to use nudity to disrupt traffic, startle little old ladies, or piss off a Scottish constable or court.

                                This also suggests that should people stop over-reacting to harmless nudity, it will be legally acceptable without changing the squishy laws.

                                -Mark

                                Comment

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