Introduction to communal nudity

[Nate Dekan]

Dear Gary Naturist,

Unfortionatly, I'm not at all surprised that your discomfort with erections has limited your involvement in nudism. I think the attitude most clubs have on this issue limits the involvement of many people and therefore limits the growth of nudism. Have you read the "Body Acceptance?" article here on INA's site? http://www.clothesfree.com/bodyacceptance.html
Errections should only be a problem if the persons BEHAVIOUR is a problem. If a persons behaviour is a problem it needs to be delt with whether there is an erection or NOT.

Nate

[Xen]

I went to a nude swim in London (UK) last night for men only and got chatting to a couple of Americans who had come for the first time.

I asked what had brought them along - and if they were naturists. It seemed that they weren't it was just that they were quite used to swimming naked - as they always had done at the YMCA - in a single sex environment and thought nothing if it.

Unfortunately in the UK we have no (recent) tradition of nude swimming such as you are lucky enough to have in the US.

[desertdude]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Nate Dekan:
[qb]Dear Gary Naturist,

Unfortionatly, I'm not at all surprised that your discomfort with erections has limited your involvement in nudism. I think the attitude most clubs have on this issue limits the involvement of many people and therefore limits the growth of nudism. Have you read the "Body Acceptance?" article here on INA's site? http://www.clothesfree.com/bodyacceptance.html
Errections should only be a problem if the persons BEHAVIOUR is a problem. If a persons behaviour is a problem it needs to be delt with whether there is an erection or NOT.

Nate[/qb]

---

I read the above mentioned article on body accepted on the INA site and I was puzzled by it. It doesn't come right out and say that erections should be hidden, in fact it implies they should not be, yet it is and has been the policy of the INA to delete pictures on the website that show erections when forum members have pointed them out to the staff. I can remember a specific case where a picture showed the erection of a little boy that was with his sister and family. It was promptly deleted. It would be helpful if the naturist philosophy was consistent with the policies of the INA website, otherwise it is hypocritical. Just my opinion. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img]

[David77]

I,likewise, swam nude at the YMCA for a period of over 20 years when I was young. I also took a course in (water) lifesaving, in the nude, which made it necessary to practice rescueing each other nude, and "wrestling" in the water nude, to try to break the "deathgrip" of a person who might grab the rescuer around the neck to keep from drowning.

Then I became a lifegard at the YMCA, nude.

On the roof of this tall YMCA building, they provided a very nice sundeck to sunbath nude (or semi-nude if they so choose).

Swimming nude now at resorts seems so usual and ordinary. I still love the water and swimming. I still swim laps about four times a week at a new Y, but it is a "Family Y" and no more nude swimming as both genders always swim together.

[mel]

Isn't it funny how times have changed. When I was young all the boys swam nude together and showered together. Now when I go to the heath center, alot of the men and boys will wear their underware to and from the private showers. Heaven help them if someone was to see them nude! Some of these men are the same ones who swam nude in school when they were young. I'm glad I didn't change.

[David77]

Mel,
At the Family Y that I go to now, the men have no priate showers but very nice group type showers. No one wears their underwear to and from the shower, but occasionally, but not often, someone may wear a towel around their waist. They more often may carry their towel over their left wrist and casually let it hang down in front of them to and from the locker room and shower. So much for "body acceptance"!

[Nate Dekan]

quote:

---

Originally posted by desertdude:
[qb]

I read the above mentioned article on body accepted on the INA site and I was puzzled by it.
http://www.clothesfree.com/bodyacceptance.html

It doesn't come right out and say that erections should be hidden, in fact it implies they should not be, yet it is and has been the policy of the INA to delete pictures on the website that show erections when forum members have pointed them out to the staff. I can remember a specific case where a picture showed the erection of a little boy that was with his sister and family. It was promptly deleted. It would be helpful if the naturist philosophy was consistent with the policies of the INA website, otherwise it is hypocritical. Just my opinion. [img]/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif[/img] [/qb]

---

From my expereince, it really doesn't seem hypocritical to me, it seems smart. If public nudity doesn't get many people upset enuogh, public erections will, including many nudists. Oftentimes it is best to talk about things before getting visibly in peoples face about them. When it comes to kids especially, with many people thinking any picture of children without clothes is porn (I wont even go into how dangerious I think that kind of programing is) taking the picture you mentioned off is very smart.

When it comes to issues that upset a lot of people I think the article at the following link is right on the money.
http://www.experiencegrace.com/Stumbling_Block.html

INA is talking about AND showing nudity in a positive way, with the above article they are also presenting a positive perspective on erections (thats more than any other naturist organization I know of is doing) with the way many people feel about both subjects that's probably about as far as they should stretch the envelope at this time. When a far larger percentage of people become more openly accepting of nudity, perhaps they could push the envelope a bit further regarding erections.

Nate

[Trailscout]

Nate,
Thanks to you and the other admins for deleting photos that could be interpreted as erotica. We should go out of our way not to give cause for criticism. Nudists have plenty of enemies in the textile world; let's not give them any ammunition.

I believe that some of the men who are so eager for erection acceptance in nudist camps are doing so not because they are afraid of being punished for "perking up" during a nap by the pool, but because they feel constrained by platonic naturism and their agenda is to reinvent the nudist camp as a hotbed of public sex with everything that moves.

As long as textile society persists in it's warped view of the body, sexual predators, peodophiles, exhibitionists, flashers, S&M types, voyeurs, gays and swingers will seek sanctuary in nudist camps and nude beaches. We will have to remain vigilent to make them feel unwelcome in our midst and to kick them out the minute they get out of line, coordinating our efforts with local law enforcement as needed.

[SirronD]

I am gay. It is not some perversion or afectation, or afliction. It simply is.

I absolutely resent that being gay is publically placed in the same category as "sexual predators, peodophiles....."

Trailscout, I have very much respected your ideas and beliefs (as you have shared them within these fourms), even if I have not shared those same beliefs. But that was because you always spoke with respect and consideration.

But I have lost that respect today to see such a bigotry. And to see that not only do you hold a belief that I (as a gay man) am a sexual predator (simply because I am gay), but that you also actively and vigilently (by your own words) work to make me unwelcome.

Well, your work is done.

[Gary Naturist]

Trailscout, I too am appalled at your categorizing gays with sexual predators, pedophiles, etc. At best, your comment is ignorant, at worst it's bigoted.

I also take issue with your comments about those who have discussed erections in these forums. You are inputing motives with no basis at sll for doing so.

Gary

[Nate Dekan]

Trailscout,

I know personally several younger men, and know of many, many others that have absolutely no interest in turning nudist clubs or beaches into hotbeds of public sex. They would like to go to such clubs and beaches but don't due to concern of getting an erection, and fear of how people they don't know may react to that. Many are comfortable nude (with or without erections) with like-minded friends or family with nothing sexual going on at all. Concern of unwanted erections is far more prevalent among younger males than older ones and interestingly most of the males I see at nudist clubs are quite a bit older! (Most clubs I've seen would make great retirement communities!)

I also feel it is bad policy, immoral, and un-Christian to pre-judge people or make people feel unwelcome UNLESS and until they get out of line, then, if people do get out of line and say are doing something sexual in public (having an erection is not DOING something sexual, playing with it is) then we must step in to maintain the high standards of the beach or club.

Nate

[Bartamus]

DesertDude: I'm sure you know the difference
between exhibitionism and naturism. Good!
We do too. That basically explains our
philosophy in deleting photos that seem only
to serve one purpose..that being to show off
the physical attributes of the sender
That's our policy.

[David77]

SirronD,
I am so sorry that, in essence, your personal worthy and inherent dignity was so viciously attacked for being your fundamental self.

[David77]

SirronD,
I am very sorry about the vicious attack which, in effect, denied your personal worth and inherent dignity - because of your being your fundamental, natural self.

[Bob S.]

Trailscout,

I, too, take issue with your statement,
"As long as textile society persists in it's warped view of the body, sexual predators,
peodophiles, exhibitionists, flashers, S&M types, voyeurs, gays and swingers will seek
sanctuary in nudist camps and nude beaches."

Now, understanding Sirron's rightful objections, I want to touch on another aspect of it. I don't believe any of these groups necessarily seeks sanctuary at nudist venues. Far from it, especially at nudist clubs. Exhibitionists and flashers use the element of shock and surprise with their nudity. At these places, nudity is common and expected. No one would be shocked to see a naked body at a NUDIST park or beach.

A voyeur simply enjoys looking at naked people, usually getting a sexual thrill from it. The aforementioned groups would more than likely have behavior that would be seen as inappropriate and illicit at such places and would show in their "excitement level".

They would probably be thrown out soon after gaining entrance.

S&M is a sexual activity that is usually practiced behind closed doors. There is nothing illegal about it as long as both partners are consensual and no one is severly injured. As long as this is kept private, there is no reason why it shouldn't happen.

Sexual predators and pedophiles are special cases as they will look like any one of us. It would be hard to banish them from anywhere just by their looks. These men (yes, there are women, but mostly it is men) know how to gain the trust of someone in order to get them in private with them (I am not going to talk about violent offenders). In dealing with them, one has to be on the alert for their own safety and/or the safety of their children. If something does not feel right, it probably isn't right. And children do not have their sense of danger set up completely, yet. They trust virtually anyone who is nice to them.

You cannot go anywhere and be absolutely sure there is not any pedophiles or sexual predators around. But at nudist parks, there is the sense of protection that one has where if one of them is found there, and he is in his predatory mode, there (should be) a group of policing members of the park to show him the door and tell him not to come back. The only problem with these guys, however, is that they can only be caught and in legal trouble after they have committed their crime.

And remember that the people whom you have described also have their own beliefs. Most of them, probably about the same as those in general society, wouldn't think about attending a nudist park or beach. After all, they were raised in the same society as you were, that you shouldn't just go around naked in front of other people.

Bob S.